I am confused!

I thought that the London International Dive Show was a BSAC thing but BSAC DIVE magazine seems to be advertising a different diving show at the same time in Birmingham. Is this the same show as the Birmingham dive show which I thought usually happened in the Fall? Which is the better (BSAC) show?

I thought that the London International Dive Show was a BSAC

thing but BSAC DIVE magazine seems to be advertising a
different diving show at the same time in Birmingham. Is this
the same show as the Birmingham dive show which I thought
usually happened in the Fall? Which is the better (BSAC) show?

Nope, LIDS is run by the Eaton family dynasty (does that mean
they have to wear shoulder pads). They also run the
Birmingham NEC show normally in October (this year it's
November) and every two years Dive Scotland. It's all part of
the Diver magazine group.
They use to be in bed with BSAC, which meant that they were
often associated with BSAC and the shows were seen as BSAC
shows.

A few years ago now, BSAC renegotiated the contract and it went
to another magazine, Dive.

Diver still put on the best and largest shows and BSAC still
attend in the same way that you will see PADI, SAA & TDI. So
although they are there and it all seems the same, it is not a
BSAC show, but a Diver show.

So if you are following, me so far. What of this other show put
on by Dive? Doesnt take Einstein to work out the figures at a
rate of ?149-?174+vat a sq/mt. Smallest stand is about 6sq/m
so that's ?1044. Largest, well say 6x8m=48m = ?8352. There's
about 300 stands. So let's say a very rough ?4000 per stand x
300 = ?1.2m. Too much? Ok lets say ?2000x300 = ?600,000.

Doesnt matter which way you do the figures, even after all the
expenses. This is a lot of dosh.

Every year Dive (and others) look to cut into this market.
Others have tried and failed (Dive Shop). So why not put one on
at the same time far enough away to attract local punters or as
part of another show (watersports/ski show etc.).

So the biger LIDS & NEC gets the more you wull see rival
outfits having a go. Chances of suceeding. Nil.

And if in doubt .....

<a href="http://www.diveshows.co.uk/" >http://www.diveshows.co.uk/</a>

TerryH

Sorry to pop your balloon Terry H but I think , if I am not mistaken, you will find that the BSAC still gets a share of the profits from the LIDS show in London. Therefore it is technically a BSAC show. Maybe someone from HQ can answer that.

IMHO the other shows seem to fail because either the organisers do not want retailing at the show or they try to arrange price-fixing with exhibitors which is dangerous because if they get caught it carries heavy fines under EC law - a large percentage of a company?s turn-over. (Ask Hasbro and Toys-R-Us.)

Dive Shop failed because it was a trade show that the diving trade did not want to support.

Now some may not like the car-boot-sale aspect of Dive Shows (I am not sure I do) but that seems to be what the public wants - or it would not happen.

I am all for widening the market and those intrepid pioneers who exhibit diving-related products at the Outdoors Show may not make much profit but they should be congratulated. More divers, more readers for Diver!

Sorry to pop your balloon Terry H but I think , if I am not mistaken, you will find that the BSAC still gets a share of the profits from the LIDS show in London. Therefore it is technically a BSAC show. Maybe someone from HQ can answer that.

Of course I can John. The BSAC has a long standing arrangement with Diver that the London show is supported by the BSAC, and yes we do receive some income under this arrangement. But please don't expect the facts to get in the way of a good Terry rant, they never have before ;-)

I am all for widening the market and those intrepid pioneers who exhibit diving-related products at the Outdoors Show may not make much profit but they should be congratulated. More divers, more readers for Diver!

That's exactly the point of the new show I believe John. It's not a pure dive show, it's not in competition to the excellent LIDS and NEC dedicated dives shows, it's a section within the much wider brand of outdoor pursuits. As such I share your optimism that the attendance of the diving industry at such a show will reach potential divers who who never dream of coming to a dedicated dive show. That in itself has to be good for the sport overall.

Regards

Keith L

Of course I can John. The BSAC has a long standing arrangement with Diver that the London show is supported by the BSAC, and yes we do receive some income under this arrangement. But please don't expect the facts to get in the way of a good Terry rant, they never have before ;-)

I think you need to check on your definition of a rant. Ok so
I missed the fact that BSAC get a sub for LIDS. They dont get
one for the NEC though, do they?

Mind you depends what you mean by a sub. How many sq/mts is
your stand?

If you re-read the post I'didnt take a pop at BSAC nor did I
say that the Diver ran shows were anything other than the best
ones.

You want to stop seeing demons Keith. Your starting to get
paranoid. Who said that!!!!!!

TerryH :-)

You want to stop seeing demons Keith. Your starting to get
paranoid. Who said that!!!!!!

I am not paranoid Terry, I =KNOW= you're all out to get me ;-)

K

I think you need to check on your definition of a rant. Ok so
I missed the fact that BSAC get a sub for LIDS. They dont get
one for the NEC though, do they?

No we do not get any direct sub for the NEC show.

Mind you depends what you mean by a sub. How many sq/mts is
your stand?

Well my definition of a 'sub' in the context that you're talking about is something that makes the club money. Despite the stand, travel, accomodation and staff costs at both shows we make an overall profit for the club. So the shows cost the members nothing in terms of BSAC costs, in fact we MAKE some money for the benefit of the club and all of our members. Plus of course the presence/marketting value that you can't put a direct price on.

That's why we attend shows Terry, that's why we will continue to attend them.

Regards

Keith L

That's why we attend shows Terry, that's why we will continue to attend them.

Of course Keith, never said it was anything else apart from a
win-win for BSAC. Mind you now that you mention it .......

As you know I work at the show on another stand. My job is to
sell the company and its product (diving).

So please dont take this as anything other than a personal
observation (it's not a rant). I have no doubt that the staff
on the stand all have important roles within the BSAC office,
but can you tell me how they can really sell BSAC on the stand?

In fact wouldnt it be more effective to have divers, not admin
staff who can sell the club. How about getting more regional/area coaches on there. Divers on the blunt end who can
actually talk BSAC. Not just to point out who you have to wait
by to get an awnser!

TerryH

In fact wouldnt it be more effective to have divers, not admin
staff who can sell the club. How about getting more regional/area coaches on there. Divers on the blunt end who can
actually talk BSAC. Not just to point out who you have to wait
by to get an awnser!

At every recent show when I've had a question to ask (as TO, then, so usually a training query, eg new DTP)there has always been someone who can answer it. Many post-holders are experienced divers, and I think most admin staff have at least done a try dive!!!I've often seen some voluntary staff there too, eg coaches.
My only gripe was, they wouldn't let an "old" SD buy a new SD studybook to read before he started on new DL course...think that was unnecessarily petty.
Especially as it seems anyone (not just NQIs ) can get Instructor Handbook.

I have no doubt that the staff
on the stand all have important roles within the BSAC office,
but can you tell me how they can really sell BSAC on the stand?

We?re not only selling we?re also providing a service to our members and potential members. Representatives from both Membership and Technical are always very busy with both member enquiries and new member enquiries, we actually sign up a lot of people on cross-overs at the shows. There?s also Council around and about as well, some good networking always goes on and we?ve normally got a schedule full of meetings. So it?s not just the show and selling things, we advise our members, we answer questions, we make contacts?

In fact wouldnt it be more effective to have divers, not admin
staff who can sell the club. How about getting more regional/area
coaches on there. Divers on the blunt end who can
actually talk BSAC. Not just to point out who you have to wait
by to get an awnser!

Errr? we do that as well! There?s always somebody from coaching around, regional coaches often come along. You?ll normally find somebody (all volunteers, not staff) from the ITS side as well. Council are of course not staff and all are divers, some regional (or ex regional) coaches, some involved in local area work, some involved in ITS. [The exception is the Council geek, the BSAC Anorak In Chief, he?s only a DL and doesn?t do anything like that]. Then there?s NDC and the rebreathers, the RB try dive pool has been a huge success at all of the shows, it books solid first thing every morning and we keep getting asked for more!

So thanks for the suggestion Terry, we?re always looking for ways that we can improve things, but as a principle everything that you?ve suggested is already being done.

Anyway, I hope that this little lot answers the original question as well. The BSAC attend several shows each year because it is worth while doing so, it benefits the club in several ways. Also the new dive show isn?t - it?s a combined Outdoor Pursuits show and is not in any way in competition with the already established shows.

So - see you all at the NEC! I?ll probably come along for a day.

Regards

Keith L