BSAC Training DVD

[Taz]

Why doesn't BSAC produce a DVD on how to teach each practical lesson step by step ????

[TerryH]

Why doesn't BSAC produce a DVD on how to teach each practical lesson step by step ????

Bit of a sore point.

BSAC produced a very good Video that ran alongside the old Club & Sports
diver a few years ago. Even with the syallbus changes, loads of content,
such 88 tables etc, are still the same. So all that's needed is convert to
digital, edit and then onto DVD.

The origination has been paid for, so it wouldnt take that much dosh to
produce a viable product.

With the new DTP hopefully being unaltered for a few years, now would
be a very good time to see about an edit.

[Robs188]

I sat the instructor course and did the exams last year, and from what i gather BSAC give you the facts in the instructor manual, and then its up to the instructor to demonstate them in their own way.
In the exam as long as the demo was technically correct, demonstrated in a safe and controlled manner and broken down into easy to learn steps, then it was a pass.
Each instructor has their own way of teaching things and BSAC want to encourage this.
However I agree that a DVD with the basics on would be a good idea.

[TerryH]

Each instructor has their own way of teaching things and BSAC want to encourage this.

Double edged sword.

It's good to encourage free-thinking Instructors, but it's also very important
to have continuity and structure. The old 5 min video segments of the
pre-2001 syllabus were complementry to the lectures and guaranteed
that main points were covered.

[Taz]

don't you think it would be good idea to have a DVD showing student what they are going to be learning before the lesson begins,
i.e next week in the pool we are going to learn CBL or AV ,have a look at the DVD when you get home.
There is only one way to do this right ???
I would of loved a basic training DVD when I was learning.

[Sean Gribben]

The concept of utilising the previous video and using segments for the DTP2007 is being worked on at present.

Sean

[PeteM]

There is only one way to do this right ???

I think that is the point, there is most definitely not only one way of doing it right, a good instructor will teach in the most effective way for that student. If a DVD showed one way and the instructor showed another you would get confusion.

[paul_c]

from my training experiances every instructor demands a differnt way of doing things anyway and it must be done there way not a way youve been taught by other bods.

[purple vonny]

I might be in a minority of one here, but perhaps it is time that there was a basic standard procedure for all skills that was aplicable to all diving associations. (heresy I know!).

Having trained and dived with BSAC for a few years and then crossing over to PADI to do instructor training, not only did I struggle with changing my habits to "do it like PADI" but I generally had the mickey taken out of me!

Then came back and did the IFC to cross over to BSAC instructor and the same thing happened. The instructor trainor asked why I was doing skills "like that"? But really, the result, whichever way the skill was performed, was safe and similar.

Now if there was a core standard for all skills, it would be OK for indivdual instructors to say "but I find it more effective to do it like this".

At least this way, if students and instructors had access to the basic core skill demonstration, there would be less confusion all round.

[PeteM]

At least this way, if students and instructors had access to the basic core skill demonstration, there would be less confusion all round.

But what is the basic core skill demonstration?

An example: A simple thing, clearing a mask. The standard way is to press on the top of the frame to give a better seal, look up and breath out. Last year I had a student that brought their own mask to lessons, no matter how hard they tried they could not clear it. Swapped masks with me and did it first time but I was struggling with their mask (it was distorting to the side of the eyes and letting lots of water in). No problem teach them a different way.

If you define a basic core skill way of doing something this student is now left thinking that the way they are clearing the mask is a suboptimal or incorrect way, rather than just another way as at present. Extend this to a more complex example like CBL and you have a recipe for chaos. This will give more confusion not less.

I think the BSAC philosophy of thinking instructors that can tailor lessons to the circumstances is one of our strengths. Having centrally defined core ways of doing things would be a retrograde step

IMMV

Pete

[purple vonny]

Fair point. I'm just a bit frustrated after doing both instructor training courses and being criticised by both PADI amd BSAC instructor trainers who claim to be flexible in their teaching approaches. I've tried to pick up a flexible approach to teaching but still get "who the hell taught you to do it like that???"

Yet, the core skills are taught safely and are technically correct.

I think this is a useful debate and don't want to be argumentative, I'm just trying to be constructive.

[PeteM]

I've tried to pick up a flexible approach to teaching but still get "who the hell taught you to do it like that???"

I think that just proves there are idiots everywhere. Even if an instructor does not agree with a teaching method there are ways and means to sort it out without being rude

[TerryH]

But what is the basic core skill demonstration?

An example: A simple thing, clearing a mask. The standard way is to press on the top of the frame to give a better seal, look up and breath out. Last year I had a student that brought their own mask to lessons, no matter how hard they tried they could not clear it. Swapped masks with me and did it first time but I was struggling with their mask (it was distorting to the side of the eyes and letting lots of water in). No problem teach them a different way.

If you define a basic core skill way of doing something this student is now left thinking that the way they are clearing the mask is a suboptimal or incorrect way, rather than just another way as at present. Extend this to a more complex example like CBL and you have a recipe for chaos. This will give more confusion not less.

I think the BSAC philosophy of thinking instructors that can tailor lessons to the circumstances is one of our strengths. Having centrally defined core ways of doing things would be a retrograde step

IMMV

Pete

Well I actually agree with Vonny and dont see the problem.

Those of us who come from the other side (PADI) are well used to a formulated
approach and the best bit is that it isnt written in stone.

If as in your example the initial method doesnt work, then you switch to an
alternate. The point is that its a baseline, a harmonising method to start
with and guess what? That's exactly what you did ;)

You tried the standard method (didnt work), then went onto your alternate
(which did). The only difference is that your initial method wasnt defined.

Think we need to give students a little more credit that they can understand
the diffrence and New Instructors a little more help by defining what to
teach.

T.



.

[purple vonny]

Well I actually agree with Vonny and dont see the problem.

The point is that its a baseline, a harmonising method to start

You tried the standard method (didnt work), then went onto your alternate
(which did). The only difference is that your initial method wasnt defined.

.

This was what I was getting at. An accross the board baseline for all skills for all agencies that allows you to adapt that baseline to suit a student's needs if necessary.

It doesn't seem like such a far fetched idea.

The difficulty would be getting the "experts" to agree on the baselines for the core skills.

They all seem to agree on the basic skill elements so that would be a starting point.