Scuba & Spearfishing

[Michael Purcell]

I'm not a spearfisher myself. Not really into the whole "killi-killi" thing but I'm just curious. Is the whole debate similar to the hunting debate or is there something else to the story that I don't understand.

I guess some of the arguments might be stalking prey with a tank is much different than free-diving and not much of a "sport". (Similar to the bow vs gun debate on land)

then I guess there is the task loading issue...

shooting your buddy would suck...

there is the environmental issue but one shot one kill seems pretty environmentally friendly as opposed to dragging nets across the ocean bottom...

anyway just thought I would ask as there are a lot of angry divers in my region in regards to spearfishers these days and I thought I would try to formulate an opinion.

[Nigel Hewitt]

shooting your buddy would suck...Admitedly.

I don't eat seafood but the one kill = one meal argument works for me.
OK some people do argue that spear fishing tends to take out the mature stock who are going to be the big fry factories but the indescriminant by-catch and dump of the quota fishermen is probably far worse.

[JamesW]

I think to use a speargun with scuba kit is against the law ??
Thanks

[tony J]

anyway just thought I would ask as there are a lot of angry divers in my region in regards to spearfishers these days and I thought I would try to formulate an opinion.
Life and Diving is about double standards

Flatty bashing is a typical south coast activity however Spear fishing is a big no no, mainly because there appears that there was an anti spearfishing compain many decades ago.

At least with spearfishing the fish have a chance.

Spear fishing goes on in many european countries without any problems.

Personally I'd rather divers did not take anything from the sea bed when it is not abundant. If it is abundant then, my view changes (nothing is abundant on the south coast...) . Spear fishers do not wish to harpoon divers any more than any other field sport - and it is probably a lot better than any other fishing technique.

I've just tucked into some haddock, I bet more of the sea bed/life was destroyed to give me the fish than if it had been spearfished !

Tony

(I have never spearfished. If I did it would not be on scuba)

[Nigel Hewitt]

I think to use a speargun with scuba kit is against the law ??Not in the UK.

[NickMcV]

Oo er- Does my Posidrive #1 count as a spear? :eek:
It works very well provided you don't get a flat-head fish. Thankfully the local fish haven't evolved Torx yet........:)

[Chris aka divingchef]

At least with spearfishing the fish have a chance.

Spear fishing goes on in many european countries without any problems.

I've just tucked into some haddock, I bet more of the sea bed/life was destroyed to give me the fish than if it had been spearfished !

Tony

(I have never spearfished. If I did it would not be on scuba)


Not much of a chance with SCUBA and a bait bag !! :mad:
Freediving yepp

EU,,,Spain it is banned to SCUBA and spear,,even take in most parts. Its a criminal offence to have a speargun and SCUBA kit in the same boat.

If you feel bad about the sea bed then buy farmed !
Besides trout, & salmon you can get pike, bass, turbot, lemon sole, prawns. mussels just to mention a few !!:D

And less likly to have any of those worms !!:eek:


To be honest as a chef I dont think having a big hole punched through the flesh addes anything to the dish...
Last week we had a big grouper delivered, the size of a calf,,,,it was sad to see an ol boy like him get speared several times, tied to a bouy and left to die,, collected and sold on !!

Bon apetit
Chris

[Ben Panter]

If you feel bad about the sea bed then buy farmed !
Besides trout, & salmon you can get pike, bass, turbot, lemon sole, prawns. mussels just to mention a few !!:D

Touch more complex than that Chris... farm operations do a huge amount of (localised) damage too:

http://www.salmonfarmmonitor.org/

Truth is there are no simple solutions.

Ben

[Chris aka divingchef]

Touch more complex than that Chris... farm operations do a huge amount of (localised) damage too:

http://www.salmonfarmmonitor.org/

Truth is there are no simple solutions.

Ben


Yepp true
But managed produces a sustainable stock and the dammage stays localised.
Also you do have some escapees so there are species introduced into the local eco system.
I've seen rainbow trout in the Ria !! :confused:
The other down side is that farming brings market prices down so the boats have to be more efficient in the capturing methods.

But I agree with you there is no simple solution.

[Adrian Kelland]

Yepp true
But managed produces a sustainable stock and the dammage stays localised.
Also you do have some escapees so there are species introduced into the local eco system.
I've seen rainbow trout in the Ria !! :confused:
The other down side is that farming brings market prices down so the boats have to be more efficient in the capturing methods.

But I agree with you there is no simple solution.
Some of the feed for some farmed fish is made from the ugly catch from deep trawls. So the damage may still be done.

Adrian

[Chris aka divingchef]

Some of the feed for some farmed fish is made from the ugly catch from deep trawls. So the damage may still be done.

Adrian


So is cat food !

Talking about the ugly ones, Monkfish was made into scampi in the 70s - 80s until it became fasionable

[Chris Cherrington]

So is cat food !


As is the protein meal that is added to the food of domestic farm animals. Fish meal is fed mainly to Pigs and Chickens.

Cats and Dogs are damaging the environment, cats in particular are responsible for the deaths of many songbirds and endangered amphibians.

Farmed fish is often fed on the result of industrial fishing - a fishing method that is destroying the fry of many edible species. It is probably best not to eat farmed fish.

But then if anyone cared about the environment they would not fritter away the world's dwindling resources on pointless activities like scuba diving :p

Chris

[Adrian Kelland]

But then if anyone cared about the environment they would not fritter away the world's dwindling resources on pointless activities like scuba diving :p

Chris
Especially those longs distance drives and, even worse, flights.

[PeteM]

cats in particular are responsible for the deaths of many songbirds and endangered amphibians.

But a trivial amount compared to those wiped out by us changing the environment to such an extent that they no longer have anywhere to live
http://www.rspb.org.uk/advice/helpingbirds/unwantedvisitors/cats/Copy_of_index.asp

[steve anderson]

I was living and diving in the USA for a few years and felt like the odd one out not taking a spear gun in with me on every dive we did. HAving said that, watching some of them scared the crap out of me - I'm convinced that divers should never mix with anything more pointy that a stick of rock, especially if the pointy thing has a shed load or surgical elastic behind it.

I like the idea of the UK being pretty much pointy-free and long may it stay that way.

Steve

[David Walker]

Got a friend who dives with a speargun occasionally (well, once a year generally) and it's never a problem for the safety aspect of things (ie never shoots other divers!!!).

As for the fish, well he does eat what (little) he catches, and so not really any worse than going to Tesco and buying the same. Depending on how you do it it can be very easy, or very challenging, even with scuba kit.

David

[steve henshaw]

I'm not a spearfisher myself. Not really into the whole "killi-killi" thing but I'm just curious. Is the whole debate similar to the hunting debate or is there something else to the story that I don't understand.

I guess some of the arguments might be stalking prey with a tank is much different than free-diving and not much of a "sport". (Similar to the bow vs gun debate on land)

then I guess there is the task loading issue...

shooting your buddy would suck....

i am not so sure about that it depends on the fact of, are you the fish or the buddy.
that situ has happend twice in spain over the last year 06, one shot his mate in the head, and the other through the thigh.
sorry but it makes me laugh.

and by the way the guy shot in the head suffered nothing more than a hole in the scull.(LUCKY or what?)

there is the environmental issue but one shot one kill seems pretty environmentally friendly as opposed to dragging nets across the ocean bottom....

yes i agree one shot one kill that works but again that is not were it stops there are number of spearo's now that make a living out of it, so it's kill kill kill.

its not the kill that p****** me off, its the hit that did not quite do the job and the fish has gone deep and out of their depth.

then i come wandering round the corner to be faced with a delema do i don't i, see if i can remove the shaft from the fish.
note the word fish not a moray or a conger as this is a diffrent cup of tea all together.
grouper i have found to be able to survive having been shot in the gut, as long as you get to them quickly before they rip the shaft out themselves.


anyway just thought I would ask as there are a lot of angry divers in my region in regards to spearfishers these days and I thought I would try to formulate an opinion.

steve h

[Alison Boler]

Quite agree, Steve. I'm always afraid that they're going to mistake me for something edible!!! Not very likely these days :) but on the other hand, mistakes are all too easily made above water by highly trained people with state of the art weoponary and technology, let alone by some short sighted diver wobbling around in moving water in poor viz.

Am always impressed however, with the US divers skill at lobstering! We were out with a crowd in Florida over the summer and they were bagging them by the bagful, just by hand or by lassoo or sometimes with a metal rod that they used to tap the lobster apparently making it instintively turn in the direction of their bag!! Made it all look very easy - and it really isn't!

Allie

[steve henshaw]

I think to use a speargun with scuba kit is against the law ??
Thanks

no not in the sea
only in fresh water.

steve h

[steve henshaw]

Life and Diving is about double standards

Flatty bashing is a typical south coast activity however Spear fishing is a big no no, mainly because there appears that there was an anti spearfishing compain many decades ago.

At least with spearfishing the fish have a chance.

Spear fishing goes on in many european countries without any problems.)

yes there are problems.

because there are a number of types of spearfisherman.

its the guy's that are not any good that do the most damage.
i.e you shoot a common bream at 1kg/2kgs thats a nice fish .
now shoot a grouper 1kg/2kgs thats a joke that isn't even funny knowing they grow to 30+kg.
their excuse is it was to big for supper well at 2kgs the grouper is not even close to mature, and it could be 3yrs old .
lack of education like most things.

Personally I'd rather divers did not take anything from the sea bed when it is not abundant. If it is abundant then, my view changes (nothing is abundant on the south coast...) . Spear fishers do not wish to harpoon divers any more than any other field sport - and it is probably a lot better than any other fishing technique.)

Subsistence fishing I don’t have a problem with, and that’s were I draw the line.


Tony

(I have never spearfished. If I did it would not be on scuba)

steve h

[Chris aka divingchef]

no not in the sea
only in fresh water.

steve h


Depends also in the country.

In Spain its against the law
Also to have a spear gun and scuba kit in the same boat !

[Chris aka divingchef]

I'm not a spearfisher myself. Not really into the whole "killi-killi" thing but I'm just curious. Is the whole debate similar to the hunting debate or is there something else to the story that I don't understand.

I guess some of the arguments might be stalking prey with a tank is much different than free-diving and not much of a "sport". (Similar to the bow vs gun debate on land)

then I guess there is the task loading issue...

shooting your buddy would suck...

.


And then there is the question of NARCOSIS :eek:

[steve henshaw]

And then there is the question of NARCOSIS :eek:

Task loading and narcosis.

The task loading you become used to slowly but surely, and the narcosis will of course, be ever present in all your diving.
But again you learn to work with it, around it, not as efficient but none the less you do.

Steve h

[Katherine]

Eh... no simple solution? How about don't eat seafood...?

Katherine

[Matt-75]

Eh... no simple solution? How about don't eat seafood...?

Katherine

Not going to happen, fish is to tasty to stop eating.

[Badders (Dave)]

Not going to happen, fish is to tasty to stop eating.

It sure is. I consider myself a connoisseur of fish, I eat exotically prepared dishes, specifically covered in batter, deep fried and covered in vinegar:rolleyes: , oooh I wish I wasn't on a diet.

Badders

[Chris aka divingchef]

It sure is. I consider myself a connoisseur of fish, I eat exotically prepared dishes, specifically covered in batter, deep fried and covered in vinegar:rolleyes: , oooh I wish I wasn't on a diet.

Badders

Does one know how the fish is cooked ??:confused:
A trick question I use to use on my commis !
The fish is actually steamed, so there is a wholsome dish that will fit in with your diet :rolleyes:


Sorry, it's not the same with the spuds :D

Chris

[Badders (Dave)]

Does one know how the fish is cooked ??:confused:
A trick question I use to use on my commis !
The fish is actually steamed, so there is a wholsome dish that will fit in with your diet :rolleyes:


Sorry, it's not the same with the spuds :D

Chris

Do you mean if I take the batter off, it would be healthy, a la diet?

Have you heard of a new way to cook a whole Salmon. I heard this on saturday kitchen on Saturday.
Wrap it in cling film and tin foil and put it in the dishwasher for a cycle (without the soap), I don't know what I think about that!!:confused:

Badders

[Chris aka divingchef]

Do you mean if I take the batter off, it would be healthy, a la diet?

Have you heard of a new way to cook a whole Salmon. I heard this on saturday kitchen on Saturday.
Wrap it in cling film and tin foil and put it in the dishwasher for a cycle (without the soap), I don't know what I think about that!!:confused:

Badders

Yep take the batter off and hay presto a healthy diet !

The cooking method is not new itīs called "en paupillette" in a paper bag !!
I wouldn't cook anything in cling film especially an oily fish. that will release the nasties that are usually present in that type of film. Some years ago we wouldn't wrap cheese for the same reason. I am sure that some of the more scientific guys will have the answer to if its safe.
Another point is the dishwasher, there is always residue and a chance of it contaminating the food. The cooking temp V time also wont be accurate, how big is a whole salmon Iīve seen them weigh in at 45Kgs you'll need a big dishwasher, frankly its a gimmick

Better to get a sheet of greaseproof on top of a sheet of foil shiny side down, slice an onion and spread out, place the salmon on top of the onion, pop a few slices of lemon in the gut cavity, s&p dash of white wine sprig of dill.
Fold the paper over the salmon and then do the same with the foil sealing the edges by crimping them tightly together and totally air tight.
The whole thing will look like a giant Cornish pasty ! slide onto a baking tray place in a hot oven for no more than 15 min
The package will swell with the steam so take care on opening !

Or do the same technique with smaller pieces of fish and stick them on the BBQ !

Ahh one last thing neaver cook fish for more than 15 mins as youll end up with fish glue,,,,bon appetit
Chris

[Badders (Dave)]

The cooking method is not new itīs called "en paupillette" in a paper bag !!

Better to get a sheet of greaseproof on top of a sheet of foil shiny side down, slice an onion and spread out, place the salmon on top of the onion, pop a few slices of lemon in the gut cavity, s&p dash of white wine sprig of dill.
Fold the paper over the salmon and then do the same with the foil sealing the edges by crimping them tightly together and totally air tight.
The whole thing will look like a giant Cornish pasty ! slide onto a baking tray place in a hot oven for no more than 15 min
The package will swell with the steam so take care on opening !

Or do the same technique with smaller pieces of fish and stick them on the BBQ !

Chris

I'll have a go at that, Cheers Chris, I'll let you know how I get on

Badders

[Chris aka divingchef]

I'll have a go at that, Cheers Chris, I'll let you know how I get on

Badders


Yehh let me know.
If all else fails Iīll letyou know when I start the cookery classes ;)

Chris
Sorry I know its a plug !!

[tim_escapes]

hello all,

have thought about spear fishing for a while now as a geniune means of hunting seafood to eat. Previously in this thread there was a mention that SCUBA and spear fishing in SPAIN is illegal - does this apply if you're just using a snorkel?

Also is it realistic to expect to be able to find and successfully kill edible fish/crustaceons off Andalucia? I am a complete fishing novice, apart from a few mackerel trips off padstow when i was 10.

Thanks.

[Chris aka divingchef]

hello all,

have thought about spear fishing for a while now as a geniune means of hunting seafood to eat. Previously in this thread there was a mention that SCUBA and spear fishing in SPAIN is illegal - does this apply if you're just using a snorkel?

Also is it realistic to expect to be able to find and successfully kill edible fish/crustaceons off Andalucia? I am a complete fishing novice, apart from a few mackerel trips off padstow when i was 10.

Thanks.


Hi
It only applies to SCUBA
You should have a FEDAS sports fishing license 40 Euros and a medical ( sports fishing is only valid for a year)
You MUST be over 17 as a spear gun is regarded as a firearm (nearest translation)
You must also have a orange/red SMB tube style as opposed to buoy.
Crustaceans ie crabs and lobbies are fine but don't be tempted with scallops, mussels as all bivalves, under currents legislation, have to under go treatment in a depurifing plant, and you could face a 2 1/2 year prison sentence under the food handling laws.
There is a maximum kill weight but this differer do check with local club.

Here is a link to the FAAS, FEDAS in Andalucia http://www.fedas.es/federac/and.htm

If there is anything else just PM me

Chris

[judithbodkin]

Next our Club has it's 50th Birthday. I very surpized about the amount
of spearfishing that they used to do. We are talking 1960's to 1970's
I was given some very old photo's showing some of these guys at places
like Greatstone & Hastings.

It used to be very popular in this country around that time. I would guess
other Clubs used to do the same?

Also in Menorca 2 years I very surpized about how easy it was to buy a
spear gun. Plus I have also seen some guys going off spearfishing while I was
there. This was off the shore from Coral Moral. Ten minutes later one of these
guys was back with a baby octopus!!!! :(

[ianfirmin]

Killing and eating your own food is a very good thing for many reasons. Spear fishing seems to be an excellent way of doing it. If you are informed and concerned about the huge amount of indescriminate destruction that goes with commercial fishing then you can be very selective about what you eat.

I think one of the reasons that spear fishing has declined inthe UK is that fewer and fewer people are used to killing their own food and, anyway, there are now very few fish left.

[Chris aka divingchef]

Next our Club has it's 50th Birthday. I very surpized about the amount
of spearfishing that they used to do. We are talking 1960's to 1970's
I was given some very old photo's showing some of these guys at places
like Greatstone & Hastings.

It used to be very popular in this country around that time. I would guess
other Clubs used to do the same?

Also in Menorca 2 years I very surpized about how easy it was to buy a
spear gun. Plus I have also seen some guys going off spearfishing while I was
there. This was off the shore from Coral Moral. Ten minutes later one of these
guys was back with a baby octopus!!!! :(


Hi
Back in the 70's as a teenager living in Mallorca I used to do a lot, it financed the my boat ! I know not PC, but hay we didn't know !. it wasn't unusual to catch big groupers at 4msw or fan mussels up 2 foot just under the surface.

I used to hang out with a club at Porto Pi frequented by Josep Noguera, world champ. We also used to do a lot of underwater "archery", monitoring a competition was the first time I used SCUBA, no training was given !!
Josep would come down take his shot hang around for a while shake hands and bomb off to the surface. We thought this was great,,,,but now you can watch Tanya Streeter do much more from the sofa !

Then came the tourists by the millions and the building dust, outfall, sun protection oils all added to damage the underwater environment. In 1964 a conger bit the heel off a chap on Paguera beach in less than a foot of water, thats how close the wildlife would be, as abundant as the Red Sea but different.
I went back to a reef I used to dive a few years ago and it was dead, as is most of the coast in comparison to what it used to be like.

( sorry about the rant :o )

Here in Galicia its very popular the local club has 360 members, 340 spear fishermen.

[tim_escapes]

Thanks Chris,

You obviously know what you're on about and that's useful information. You say you need orange/red SMB tube style as opposed to buoy ?? Is this the type of speargun?? Is there anything to watch out for when buying a gun? (anyone)

Presumably there are poisonous fish and that, what are the most common?

Its seriously saddens me when i think of the way animals are treated in
modern farming processes and although getting speared must be a nasty way to go it's a natural one on one hunting situation and definitely preferable and worth promoting if you ask me.

Stupid moment, what is PM?

[Chris aka divingchef]

Thanks Chris,

You obviously know what you're on about and that's useful information. You say you need orange/red SMB tube style as opposed to buoy ?? Is this the type of speargun?? Is there anything to watch out for when buying a gun? (anyone)

Presumably there are poisonous fish and that, what are the most common?

Its seriously saddens me when i think of the way animals are treated in
modern farming processes and although getting speared must be a nasty way to go it's a natural one on one hunting situation and definitely preferable and worth promoting if you ask me.

Stupid moment, what is PM?
PM = Personel message
You need a float to mark your presence to boat users
type in "torpedo float" in google and hit images.

Or have a look at http://www.spearfishing.com/

As to what gun depends on what and where your fishing, most carry 2 guns, a long and a short shaft harpoon.

Personally I dont think spear fishing is worth promoting as most divers can only achieve depths and times that allow them to kill juvenile animals.
Chris

[simone]

I am new to your forum ( today!) and only happened to come across this Thread regarding scuba and spearfishing.

It may be of interest to you to know that there is a new EU directive which came into force this March and is applicable to all member states.

This states clearly that it is illegal to spearfish with the use of Aqualung, as well as illegal to spearfish at night.

I do not have the Act in front of me, but will post you the Directive and Article number for you to look at yourselves.

Simone
Malta
simone@maltaqua.com

[Richard Whitcombe]

Would be interested in the exact wording of that. Did look on the EC site but failed to find it.

If that is the case its a very good thing but i suspect will be widely ignored by locals on lots of countries (Greece etc in particular).

[ianfirmin]

Why is it a "very good thing"? It's a very bad thing. It diverts attention, time and money away from the REAL issues of over-fishing by fleets of trawlers who have already raped the seas and in many places extinguished stocks.

Instead the bureaucracy of the EU like to put petty restrictions in the way of individuals because we can't fight back as effectively and it gives them the thrill of meddling with other people's lives and hobbies.

[Richard Whitcombe]

Good thing - its better than nothing.

Yes on the grand scale of thing the commercial businesses are far more threat but that doesn't mean you ignore more localised problems just because of that.

[Chris aka divingchef]

If that is the case its a very good thing but i suspect will be widely ignored by locals on lots of countries (Greece etc in particular).

Here in Spain its very controlled and the Guardia Civil often stop boats with divers to check for spear guns.
Last Tues we were stopped and searched coming ashore after a shore dive.

Having said that last week we found spear gun left on the sea bed by a diver, first diver will go down on scuba do his fishing, then his mate on another boat will free dive down and collect the catch, leaving the spear gun for another day. If stopped there is no gun or fish on the scuba divers boat and there is no scuba gear on the other !

There is always a loop hole !!

[ianfirmin]

I'm sorry Richard but I cannot agree. Why is it a "localised problem"? Every fish you spear, take home and eat probably saves quite a few others that would be the by-catch of what you bought in Tesco. What IS wrong with killing and eating your own food?

The other point is that the larger problems ARE being ignored but because the suits can point to such restrictions on personal liberty as examples that they are doing something and pull the wool over you eyes.

Did you know that that red stuff, wrapped in cling film the you buy from a supermarket, labelled "Beef", somes from a living animal that has been killed and chopped up?

[Richard Whitcombe]

Not everyone eats all or sometimes any of what they cant.

Also Tesco and co dont fish in the shallow coves and coastal waters very close to the land which is typically where spear fishermen go.

Certainly from a diving point of view ive seen countless times large fish and areas decimated by spear fishing (admittedly not in the uk but abroad). Nice big grouper there to look at? Make the most of it as 2 weeks or so and it'll be dead and so on.

I've got no problem eating cow - its sustainable, bred purely for that purpose, isn't endangered, isn't going to leave the field a barren wasteland and so on.

[simone]

As promised here is the legistlation:
Council Regulation (EC) No 1967/2006 of 21 December 2006

Chapter IV relates to Prohibited fishing gears and practices

Article 8 (4) states:
"Spear-guns shall be prohibited if used in conjunction with underwater breathing apparatus (aqualung) or at night from sunset to dawn."

Chapter XI Article 32
"This regulation shall enter into force on the 30th day following its publication in the Official Journal of the European Union."

( this was published 08.02.07 so is now in force)

At the end of the act it also clearly states
"This Regulation shall be binding in its entirety and directly applicable in all Member States."

This is worth looking at as a whole as Chapter III Article 5 also relates to "Fishing protected Zones " .

In Malta we have been pushing for MPA ( marine protected areas) and this legistlation has provided extra pressure on the Government to identify and establish such areas.

Happy reading!

Simone
Malta

simone@maltaqua.com

[ianfirmin]

Yes, very reasonable points. Of course, the best answer would be education but we all know how well that works...

Sorry if it sounded like a rant but it was. I just get so fed up with people wanting to ban things they don't like. Hunting, shooting, fishing, scuba diving; what's next?

[MattS]

Not everyone eats all or sometimes any of what they catch.Sorry Richard I missed your post the first time around.

As far as I know spear fishing was discouraged by the UK diving communities during the 70s when support for competitive spear fishing was withdrawn. In order to boost scores some competitors were targeting inedible territorial species. One shot, one meal is environmentally friendly. The wiping out of inedible species, such as wrasse, from localities where spear fishing competitions were held certainly wasn't!

It was all a bit before my time but the club house mantelpiece is adorned with a selection of trophies from National and European spearfishing events :o The club eventually kicked out the spear fishers at what was allegedly a very heated branch meeting. I believe this was sometime after the BSAC introduced the not so catchy phrase 'Never carry a speargun with an aqualung'

[Chris aka divingchef]

The wiping out of inedible species, such as wrasse[/I]'

Who said itīs inedible ?? well they didnt tell the Gallegos its a bit of a favorite over here!
Readilly available at the fish market.

[MattS]

Who said itīs inedible ?? well they didnt tell the Gallegos its a bit of a favorite over here!
Readilly available at the fish market.So's Pollack...but it tastes awful:)

[Chris aka divingchef]

Its the way you cook emm !!!

I cases like these I always use the Keith Floyed school technique !
Slur, slup and another just in case !!

[GyllyLocalPete]

As a scuba diver and spearfishermen i thought id post something as this whole discussion is cringe-worthy from my point of view.

To start id just like to say that the vast majority of spearfishmen in the UK do not even consider spearing on scuba, i have never met anyone that wants to and i am strongly against it.
I know there isnt a real way of making people against it appreciate it, so all i can do is just say that it is much harder than many of you think. Some of you may know and some may not, that much time is spent in the water exploring, getting to know how the fish act and developing techniques before a single fish is even shot. At this point it must be said that you may well see beginners leaving the water with fish you regard as small seen as you are used to diving in deep water where obviously the fish are bigger, but it becomes very very selective. It is not uncommon at all to meet a spearo who will only shoot 3 species of fish.
There is more by catch rod fishing than spearfishing. By catch from spearfishing is closer to 0 than 1
salmon and sea trout are not shot, yes that is the law but no where is it stated on the internet, surely this shows we are thinking about the environment
As for the comments about wrasse etc. 1. they are not inedible :confused: i dont know of any fish that is?! clearly they are not the best eating fish but they can be made good and they should be eaten to save other species because they ARE common.
From experience i can say you see a lot more fish spearfishing than scuba. (this will cause uproar but its true, research the agachon/aspetto technique , go snorkelling and try it)
I read a comment that said the biggest fish are taken and this is not fair as they are the ones that spawn...surely taking the biggest is the best thing to do as they have had the most chances to spawn. catch a small specimen that hasnt spawned, catch an average one that has spawned a couple of times or catch the biggest one that has spawned many times? isnt the answer obvious?
Competitions: Wrasse and Dogfish are excluded from many competitions.
on average in summer there are 7000 bass along a mile shoreline, and much of this area is covered by competitors during a 6 hour competition, the total of bass at the end of a succesful competition would probably be around 50. The vast majority being over the minimum size for the competition (which id like to add is higher than the actual capture size of bass), of course all the other fish have a minimum size also which is purposley made much higher than the size at which the fish becomes mature.Wiping out areas of fish? I think not.

Picture yourself lying in the weed at 15 metres depth in pure silence, not even a bubble...when a large shoal of bass come storming by, you pick the biggest one and return to the surface with dinner, the satisfaction of being in the ocean and no guilt seen as the fish in your hands hasnt been pair trawled and its shoal hasnt been wiped out.

Then tell me that spearfishing is barbaric and unethical.

[GyllyLocalPete]

thats been around for a while. who spearfishes at night anyways ?
there are many more rules regarding spearfishing in france etc that would maybe even confuse a lot of people. e.g. it is illegal to use a torch let alone have one on you when you enter the water with a speargun.

[GyllyLocalPete]

Personally I dont think spear fishing is worth promoting as most divers can only achieve depths and times that allow them to kill juvenile animals.
Chris[/QUOTE]


This is not intended as malicious but how can a scuba diver know what is in shallow water when all they do is briefly pass it whilst making lots of bubbles and noise.

People need to find out about spearfishing techniques and go for a quick snorkell in shallow water. You'll be surprised.