View Full Version : Miserable learner needs help!!
Hello BSAC!! Someone suggested I check out you guys to see if you can help me? :)
I started trying to learn to dive with PADI but feel I have got nowhere!! Basically, the problem is that I'm a slow learner and cannot keep up with the furious pace that PADI seems to expect - it just doesn't feel comfortable- I usually get only one go at each skill and no time to practice. I feel undertrained and increasingly scared that at the end of the course I'm going to be told 'Go forth and dive' but actually I will be a danger to myself and others!!! I'm so fed up am thinking about giving up....and I've spent a fortune!!:(
From what I've seen on the site it seems that BSAC teach in a different way? Has anyone else encountered this problem with PADI?
Yvonne
The primary difference between BSAC & PADI is that generally you join a branch. This is a club of people who want to dive. They are not earning their living from diving, but doing something they enjoy together.
(There are BSAC schools, commercial orgainisations, but this is the exception rather than the rule.)
Branches fall into two catagories, those that only dive & don't teach, (or do little teaching,) those that teach new members as well as orgainise diving.
In my case my branch has a large emphasis on training, we have a pool available through out the year one night a week. For us it does not matter if you complete a lesson each week, or it takes you a number of weeks to complete the lesson, we are their every week.
This is the general attitude of most branches.
So in summary, if you are a slow learner, or wish to take time, or need to build your confidence progressively, you will probably find it beneficail to join a BSAC branch.
One word of caution, ensure you find a branch that does do a lot of teaching, & that has an ample number of active instructors.
Gerenally we are a friendly bunch! (we also accept crossovers from other orgainisations).
cross over information
http://www.bsac.org/techserv/salt.pdf
branch locations
http://www.bsac.com/meet/branchsites.html
Gareth
judithbodkin
30-05-2006, 01:55
Hi Yvonne
What Gareth has said I would go along with. You haven't mentioned which area
you live?
:)
Adrian Kelland
30-05-2006, 08:30
Yvonne,
Generally branches are able to cope with students progressing at different rates and there is usually someone available to help you practice. Some branches are so busy they have a waiting list.
If you say where you are, you may find that there is someone from a local branch is online here. One less problem to overcome.
Adrian
cannonfodder
30-05-2006, 08:59
Hello BSAC!! Someone suggested I check out you guys to see if you can help me? :)
I started trying to learn to dive with PADI but feel I have got nowhere!! Basically, the problem is that I'm a slow learner and cannot keep up with the furious pace that PADI seems to expect - it just doesn't feel comfortable- I usually get only one go at each skill and no time to practice. I feel undertrained and increasingly scared that at the end of the course I'm going to be told 'Go forth and dive' but actually I will be a danger to myself and others!!! I'm so fed up am thinking about giving up....and I've spent a fortune!!:(
From what I've seen on the site it seems that BSAC teach in a different way? Has anyone else encountered this problem with PADI?
Yvonne ,
dont forget you are the customer tell your instructor how you feel!
He/She might not realise so can not addapt there teaching style pehaps a little word might do the trick.
Dont give up diving its so wondefull :D
Take care
Safe Diving
SpeedDemon
30-05-2006, 11:30
Yeah I agree, Im a PADI diver and the course can be a bit hectic sometimes but do not let that detract you from an exciting sport, you just need confidence and I am sure you will find that at a BSAC club, they are GREAT too. My brother trained with BSAC but he will only dive abroad and wont join me for some UK diving.
Thats the beauty of different organisations/clubs...if you dont like one you will love the other.
C'mon BSAC, get Yvonne in the water and fully trained (please);)
kath2407
30-05-2006, 11:50
I remember it took me about 4 weeks to clear my mask!!! (not in total i did go home in between!!!) and I cried whilst doing it.
You will soon learn that if you join a BSAC branch its all about (all together now) PRACTISE PRACTISE PRACTISE.
Everyone is different and if it takes you 6 days or 6 months to get everything right - thats your choice. You are not going to enjoy yourself if you feel under constant pressure and unconfident.
As the others have said, look on the BSAC website - find a local branch and go and chat to them - most branches end up in a pub after their pool sessions!!!!
K XX
Tony Dwyer
30-05-2006, 11:52
Hello BSAC!! Someone suggested I check out you guys to see if you can help me? :)
I started trying to learn to dive with PADI but feel I have got nowhere!! Basically, the problem is that I'm a slow learner and cannot keep up with the furious pace that PADI seems to expect - it just doesn't feel comfortable- I usually get only one go at each skill and no time to practice. I feel undertrained and increasingly scared that at the end of the course I'm going to be told 'Go forth and dive' but actually I will be a danger to myself and others!!! I'm so fed up am thinking about giving up....and I've spent a fortune!!:(
From what I've seen on the site it seems that BSAC teach in a different way? Has anyone else encountered this problem with PADI?
Yvonne
Firstly, where do you live. It's very likely that one or more of us that take part in this madhouse may be able to help you. I'm in Basildon, Essex and you would be welcomed at our branch or at many others.
I would suggest that your instructor is not giving you the support & time you need. PADI requires that the Instructor observe 'mastery' of skills by a student before certification. That can take a variable degree of practice depending on the student and the quality of the instruction. Your instructor needs to give you space & time to complete the skills. There is no schedule that says you have to rip through all the skills in say 4 days. Though most commercial dive training operators will expect to complete the basics of PADI 'Open Water Diver' in that time, good ones will know that some students will need more time and that they must factor that in to their schedules.
If you are not comfortable, then you should discuss it with your instructor. It is possible (though in my humble opinion, it should be unlikely) that he or she is unaware of your difficulty. If he or she is any good, help will be forthcoming.
Personally I would suggest the club environment that BSAC uses, you can usually learn at your own pace and will not be pressured to go beyond your personal capabilities. This is certainly true for my branch, where we conduct training on a rolling basis, with students in the programme at all levels.
Are you learning to dive just for holidays abroad or are you likely to dive in & around the UK?
regards
Tony
BSAC & PADI instructor.
Chris Cherrington
30-05-2006, 17:41
Hi there. PADI like to train folks fast as folks like to qualify fast..
Try not to waste anything you have spent - the school should take you through the Open Water as that is what you paid for.
Sounds to me like a very good idea to then join your local BSAC and get some more help with the bits you are less than confident with. However, make sure as everyone says that the branch are able to help you and above all make sure that you will get some diving with your new friends. A good branch is a great place to be and a poor one will put you off BSAC for life :)
Hope it all works out for you - there's lots of help on this forum - its a great starting point and people here will help you find the branch you need.
Stick with it.
All the best
Chris
Green750one
01-06-2006, 14:07
Yvonne ,
dont forget you are the customer tell your instructor how you feel!
He/She might not realise so can not addapt there teaching style pehaps a little word might do the trick.
Dont give up diving its so wondefull :D
Take care
Safe Diving
Interesting point.
I was very disappointed with the tuition (and attitude) I received when I did my PADI AOW course.
We were told to read the relevant chapters in the course material but weren't tested and I'd put money on me being the only student who actually read the material.
I buddy'd with one of the dive-masters and I'm glad I did. The other students were just jumping in - no safety checks. One even had his cylinder fall out of his bcd. I wouldn't have trusted any of them to be of any use in an emergency. Half of them couldn't even get neutral!
The worse thing though was the party that went on on Saturday night - not just excesses of drink, but drugs too. (No I didn't partake, I went to bed).
So when I sent my evaluation off to PADI I complained and to my surprise absolutely nothing happened.
Have to say too that this was in the UK. My Open water course was in Kos and was excellent though.
Philip
Mark Cowgill
01-06-2006, 14:17
Where do you live Yvonne
Mark
Hi ,
It is always a shame to read such poor statements about PADI, and even more shameful no counterclaims, but i must agree i visited 2 PADI centers before i got my C-card (not with PADI :mad:. i found the attitude flippant at one and "i cant be bothered at the other, as always you try something like this it worrying you have to feel safe and confident with your instructor at the end of the day your life is in there hands. as everyone one else has said join your local BSAC, i should have joined medway last night couldn't make it "sorry Jude see ya Monday promise" anyway don't give its a fantastic sport and the people are all eloco :p o
happy diving
Colin
Not all padi centres are bad theres a good one in Poole 1st class.
Hi ,
It is always a shame to read such poor statements about PADI, and even more shameful no counterclaims, but i must agree i visited 2 PADI centers before i got my C-card (not with PADI :mad:. i found the attitude flippant at one and "i cant be bothered at the other, as always you try something like this it worrying you have to feel safe and confident with your instructor at the end of the day your life is in there hands. as everyone one else has said join your local BSAC, i should have joined medway last night couldn't make it "sorry Jude see ya Monday promise" anyway don't give its a fantastic sport and the people are all eloco :p o
happy diving
Colin
Well, you wouldn't expect many PADI counterclaims on a BSAC website, would you? I thought I was the lone PADI diver who visits here?
I was PADI trained. I loved the 'get it done quick and then acquire the experience method". I will agree this method is probably more suited to learning in clear waters BUT by the time I started diving in the UK I had notched up nearly 100 dives so I was prepared (almost :)) for the UK.
Mind you, I learnt 20 odd years ago (OW with Frankie's, Gozo and AOW with George at Calypso, Gozo) and I was VERY happy with the training and methodology and professionalism ......but, then, I didn't find diving difficult and neither was I scared of being under water.
As a few of you may know from my YD diatribes that I am particularly anti the "PC, someone else is to blame, you mustn't do that, over regulated world" we live in these days. Of course, I am from a generation that was taught respect for others and the importance of common sense.
With reference to the drugs ......... I have no intention of trying to defend that or, especially, doing it in front of students or being seen (:)) BUT it is their life .......... So long as they are capable of doing the dive the next day then what they do is their own business. I suspect the leaver was leaving more on a moral ground than ........? How many divers drink the night before a dive and, is not the associated next day dehydration more of a problem?
Of course, no one can deny the PADI system is business oriented and, as such, there are limited opportunities for dealing with slow learners. Maybe I am being unfair when I say that the basic course is not rocket science, nor is it difficult. If problems occur for a student because of fear of being under water then a PADI holiday OW course is NOT the way to learn!
In short, I like the PADI way and am happy with the training I got (went up to RD) before going TDI for Adv EANx/Deco. Not every instructor (in every branch of teaching) is going to be brilliant.
I have read of BSAC club problems too (granted - not first hand knowledge). One of the BSAC myths (?) is you might be allowed in the sea in a year or so once you've finished your pool training? :) Perhaps this no longer applies (along with the need to have a beard? :)).
Chris Cherrington
05-07-2006, 14:01
...Of course, no one can deny the PADI system is business oriented and, as such, there are limited opportunities for dealing with slow learners. ...
It is many years since I worked in the industry but the "correct" PADI solution to a student that is having problems is much the same as the BSAC one. One to one extra sessions with a DM (DL).
In real terms a PADI OW course now costs half what I paid when I learnt. this doesn't leave a lot of money for the DM (usually unpaid anyway) to remedy problems.
Buy me a pint and I can sit and slag off PADI all night (BSAC too if you like :)) but in truth the customers have driven down the price and with it the "slack" in the system.
A good PADI instructor will turn out good divers. There is nothing wrong with the structure. If the public want fast track and instant gratification then any business will provide it or fail. Its refreshing to hear of a diver that wants to take a bit more time and I wish her all the best. Don't let her down BSAC chaps..
Chris
It is many years since I worked in the industry but the "correct" PADI solution to a student that is having problems is much the same as the BSAC one. One to one extra sessions with a DM (DL).
In real terms a PADI OW course now costs half what I paid when I learnt. this doesn't leave a lot of money for the DM (usually unpaid anyway) to remedy problems.
Buy me a pint and I can sit and slag off PADI all night (BSAC too if you like :)) but in truth the customers have driven down the price and with it the "slack" in the system.
A good PADI instructor will turn out good divers. There is nothing wrong with the structure. If the public want fast track and instant gratification then any business will provide it or fail. Its refreshing to hear of a diver that wants to take a bit more time and I wish her all the best. Don't let her down BSAC chaps..
Chris
Sage words.
Also, don't forget to encourage the BSAC chapesses as well as the chaps! :)
Nigel Hewitt
05-07-2006, 15:05
I've spent a fortune!!
Has anyone else encountered this problem with PADI?I'm sorry Yvonne but I don't believe in you.
You have so exactly pulled all the BSAC strings. The truth is PADI courses aren't furious. There isn't much to learn and you do it reasonably slowly. If they were telling you to go out and dive you passed the standards. A lot of nice people here have tried to help but I fear they can't because you are a work of fiction. Sorry.
Chris Cherrington
05-07-2006, 15:20
I'm sorry Yvonne but I don't believe in you.
Whatever next????
You'll tell me this fellow is not real too..... :cool:
http://www.swiss-riviera.com/christmas-market/img/father_xmas.jpg
Chris
I'm sorry Yvonne but I don't believe in you.
You have so exactly pulled all the BSAC strings. The truth is PADI courses aren't furious. There isn't much to learn and you do it reasonably slowly. If they were telling you to go out and dive you passed the standards. A lot of nice people here have tried to help but I fear they can't because you are a work of fiction. Sorry.
OH NO!!! Not a troll? Nigel, say 'it ain't so'!! :):)
I'd forgotten about trolls and I never thought one would appear on the BSAC forum and ANYWAY, I was replying to Colin so that means I'm safe from troll cooties!
:):)
Chris Cherrington
05-07-2006, 17:06
OH NO!!! Not a troll? Nigel, say 'it ain't so'!! :):)
Its a santa troll....
http://z.about.com/d/collectdolls/1/0/l/G/troll.jpg
Chris
In real terms a PADI OW course now costs half what I paid when I learnt. This doesn't leave a lot of money for the DM (usually unpaid anyway) to remedy problems.
I learnt to dive 15 years ago, with PADI. At that time it cost me £1,000 to do my PADI Open Water and PADI Advanced (Adventures in Diving) Open Water Course. These days it typically costs about £300 for a PADI Open Water course. 1/5th of the cost a decade and half ago, and look how much the cost of living has risen in that time. As Chris said, this leaves not much slack to pay for extra pool time. £50 + VAT for an hour (and this is cheap), and you haven't even thought about adding on salary for the instructor.
in truth the customers have driven down the price and with it the "slack" in the system.
Yes, absolutely, I could not agree more. Prices have been pared to the bone. I remember someone complaining on one of the forums recently about their weight belt falling to pieces after one year. I was not at all surprised. With the consumer constantly complaining that "they have been ripped off", and pushing for cheap prices, the manufacturers have responded. They are now seeking cheaper products from the far east. You get what you pay for. Equipment is not going to last as it should and you will not receive the level of training you deserve, because there is no slack in the system. Instructors, on the whole, do the very best job they can, under huge constraints.
A good PADI instructor will turn out good divers. There is nothing wrong with the structure. If the public want fast track and instant gratification then any business will provide it or fail. Its refreshing to hear of a diver that wants to take a bit more time and I wish her all the best.
Any good instructor will turn out good divers. It is not the training agency, it is down to the quality of the instructor. There are some storming BSAC instructors out there, and some abysmal ones. There are some incredible PADI instructors out there, and some down right awful ones. And I could repeat this statement for every other diving training agency. So why is PADI mentioned so much? Well perhaps because they are the biggest certifying agency in the World, doing a million certifications a year.
I am pleased to hear of a diver that wishes to train at a sensible pace and really get good muscle memory on her skills. It will make her a better, safer diver. But I think it time to draw a line about 'PADI this' and 'BSAC that'. Both these agencies have their strengths and weaknesses.
BSAC's strength has got to be club system. The fact that when you have completed a training course, more than likely you will be able to regularly access a pool and keep your skills current and crisp. That you are able to be mentored and gain experience.
PADI gets people diving and excited about our fine, sexy, glorious sport.
Chris Cherrington
05-07-2006, 19:51
.... But I think it time to draw a line about 'PADI this' and 'BSAC that'. Both these agencies have their strengths and weaknesses.
I could not agree more..
BSAC's strength has got to be club system.
Aye. But it is also its greatest weakness...
The fact that when you have completed a training course, more than likely you will be able to regularly access a pool and keep your skills current and crisp. That you are able to be mentored and gain experience.
Ideal for Yvone (if she exists ! Nigel doesn't think so...)
Perhaps not a bad thing for many of us :)
I do very much like the idea of "mentoring" - what a great way to get a person to their best. I would like to mentor the OP to log on and respond... come on - we want to help you... honest :D
Chris
Badders (Dave)
05-07-2006, 21:18
From the things I've read and and heard people say, I have come up with this, well actually I nicked it from the old Stella Artois Adverts::)
PADI:- Reassuringly rushed:eek:
BSAC:- Reassuringly slow:rolleyes:
I did (am doing) it the slow way. unrushed and leisurely, suits me down to the ground
Badders
Dave
couldn't agree more thats how i learned slowly and enjoy it
happy diving
Chris Cherrington
05-07-2006, 23:18
From the things I've read and and heard people say, I have come up with this, well actually I nicked it from the old Stella Artois Adverts::)
PADI:- Reassuringly rushed:eek:
BSAC:- Reassuringly slow:rolleyes:
I did (am doing) it the slow way. unrushed and leisurely, suits me down to the ground
Badders
I am honestly pleased this has worked for you. However, the BSAC has lost a good many folk over the years as they have got fed up waiting to get their ticket.
Roz made the point there is good and bad in both systems and yet the very next post has emoticons that reinforce idiotic sterotypes. Well done....
Chris
Badders (Dave)
06-07-2006, 00:43
I am honestly pleased this has worked for you. However, the BSAC has lost a good many folk over the years as they have got fed up waiting to get their ticket.
Roz made the point there is good and bad in both systems and yet the very next post has emoticons that reinforce idiotic sterotypes. Well done....
Chris
Chris,
Me no understanee. could you explain what you mean. sorry for being a bit thick:confused: , but sometimes its necessary to draw me a picture!
By the way I wasn't trying to reinforce anything I was just having a bit of word fun:D and taking the proverbial out of the stereotyping.
Badders
Chris Cherrington
06-07-2006, 08:53
.. I was just having a bit of word fun:D and taking the proverbial out of the stereotyping.
Well I'm all for that mate. Perhaps me taking things too seriously - which is very out of character :D
Chris
I learnt with PADI and will be continuing my education with PADI, mainly because at the end of it, you get paid to instruct. Not that i wont maybe instruct BSAC people, if you remain nice and friendly.
Another good PADI centre can be found in Porthcawl, South Wales. They were my teachers originally and i thank them for introducing me into this sport. I've seen underwater stuff that a non diver will never likely see. :)
And yes....Yvonne sounds like a troll, but why on this forum? Its not like this is YD, people here are a little more refined (and older (in a good way)). :p
David Walker
07-07-2006, 09:58
I learnt with PADI and will be continuing my education with PADI, mainly because at the end of it, you get paid to instruct.
True, but you have to teach an awful lot of people to get back what you spent on the course, the exam, the materials, insurance, membership, and paying your DMs if you're teaching in the UK!
David
Andy Wade
07-07-2006, 10:09
I learnt with PADI and will be continuing my education with PADI, mainly because at the end of it, you get paid to instruct.
How to get a million pounds by teaching diving:
First, take two million pounds and set up a large dive school.
Run this for five years with all the associated hangers on and expenses.
Hey presto. You'll now have one million pounds!
:D
Ant Slegg
07-07-2006, 10:30
Yvonne - as a slow learner from 1990 I understand the problems you are having. I took several weeks to learn how to clear a mask (with the BS-AC) but over the years have done 500+ dives got into instructing, nitrox, trimix and rebreather diving. I've done courses with the BS-AC, IANTD, TDI and crossed-over as a PADI Divemaster and no one organisation does it all correctly.
The best advice I can give you is to contact branches in your area, find out how much basic training they do AND find out if members of the club progress to the more adventurous stuff (trimix, rebreathers etc.) This will give you an idea if you can get your basic open water certificate and when you've built up experience if you can progress into other things you find interesting.
Also ask about the social side (most branches can scrape together a Xmas party) but some do little or nothing.
Ask about dive trips (weekends, weeks, foreign trips) and the level of qualification required. If you end up as an Ocean Diver (~PADI Advanced OWD) and all the diving is for Advanced Divers (i.e. depths in excess of 35m) then there will not be much for you to do.
Also find out if they can provide kit for you to train in (cylinder, reg, BC etc.), what they charge for training and what that includes (most dive trips for training cost extra in my experience).
If you don't think a branch is for you then try a different one before signing up for membership and/or courses.
Bear in mind that the oldest active diver I've met was over 80 and going strong and I met a trimix diver who is late 60s so there's plenty of time to learn and build up experience.
Ant S (BS-AC 380 - Hatfield, Herts, BS-AC 1913 - Den Haag, The Netherlands) - both great training branches
Chris Cherrington
07-07-2006, 10:31
How to get a million pounds by teaching diving:
First, take two million pounds and set up a large dive school.
Run this for five years with all the associated hangers on and expenses.
Hey presto. You'll now have one million pounds!
:D
Andy you will get in trouble again for being cynical. I'm not going to back you up this time either.. (it wouldn't take anywhere near five years to loose a mill).
Chris
PS Hal if you do your BSAC OWI you can cross back to PADI without the DM... And the BSAC OWI is cheaper. And you can get paid for being a BSAC OWI as they are now letting dive shops do BSAC courses. And the real money is in technical BTW... ;)
Hey steady on BSAC people!!! I seem to have pushed some buttons with my entirely genuine enquiry?:confused:
As for the speculation about my existence- I can assure you that I am real although not sure how to prove it??!! The reason I didn't say too much about my PADi experiences or my location is that I don't feel it is fair to criticise anyone in a public forum where they don't have the 'right to reply'. Suffice it to say that my experiences were less than happy and when I described myself as a slow learner I was trying to be charitable.
I do however have one big question?? What is a troll???? I have now found a branch and will be appearing in the flesh at a pool session in the foreseeable future. I trust that at this point I will be able to prove my existence and possibly one of the branch members might be able to post on here to verify that I am most definitely not short, fat, plastic and very hairy!!! ;)
Thanks to everyone for your support!!
Yvonne.
Dave (Simmo)
09-07-2006, 12:02
Hi Yvonne,
An "Internet troll" or "Forum Troll" is a person who posts outrageous message to bait people to answer. Forum Troll delights in sowing discord on the forums. A troll is someone who inspires flaming rhetoric, someone who is purposely provoking and pulling people into flaming discussion. Flaming discussions usually end with name calling and a flame war.
As in light blue touch paper and stand well back....
that's a definition I found on the net - it's a bit extreme. in essence you made your original post back in May about an emotive subject then disappeared.
Don’t be offended, there is no need to prove you exist, lots of people tried to answer your query and posed questions expecting you to reply when you didn't we [I thought the same] assumed you were sat back having a chuckle at us arguing with ourselves.
Dave
Ben Panter
09-07-2006, 12:03
I do however have one big question?? What is a troll????
A troll is a word used for a poster who puts forward a point of view or discussion that they know will cause massive argument. It may not be their own view, but one that they know will cause maximum agro. Generally frowned upon, as we'd all like these forums to be sensible and productive, which they usually are. Very occasionally we close threads that have run their course, but usually we just let it ride.
The topic you picked is one that comes up on diving fora / usenet groups often enough that we're all bored of it, hence the slightly hostile response. Many of us have trained in both systems, and are well aware of the differences between the two. Don't let it put you off, these fora are a mine of information for divers of all levels and we'd like it if you stayed.
One way to show that you are who you say you are would be to put your BSAC membership details in 'user cp' then 'edit profile'. Although this is only visible to the forum administrators it allows you to post in the BSAC members area, which at least proves that you are a member of BSAC and not an existing poster looking to wind people up with a second identity. You can find these details on your membership card, which should arrive in the post sometime after you've joined your branch.
Best of luck with your branch training, and look forward to seeing more of your questions here.
Ben
How to get a million pounds by teaching diving:
First, take two million pounds and set up a large dive school.
Run this for five years with all the associated hangers on and expenses.
Hey presto. You'll now have one million pounds!
:D
I never said i'd get rich doing it. My plans are a little better thought out than you give me credit for. What little i make from teaching would hopefully cover my expenses (or at least i hope it would). Beyond that as long as i have gas fills, food and beer, i'd be fairly happy.
Anyways its just a view, my view, and as much as im a part of the bsac way of doing things i still prefer padi ways over them. I think its due to the way it was taught, for me it was a no bs way and perfect for the way i prefer to learn. While it doesnt suit everyone and it is somewhat speedy, i found it perfect for me. If someone is having problems, then moving to bsac is probably a good idea as the whole process takes a lot longer to complete, but chances are you'll need that time to build up your confidence in the water anyway.
Andy Wade
10-07-2006, 04:13
I never said i'd get rich doing it. My plans are a little better thought out than you give me credit for. What little i make from teaching would hopefully cover my expenses (or at least i hope it would). Beyond that as long as i have gas fills, food and beer, i'd be fairly happy.
Anyways its just a view, my view, and as much as im a part of the bsac way of doing things i still prefer padi ways over them. I think its due to the way it was taught, for me it was a no bs way and perfect for the way i prefer to learn. While it doesnt suit everyone and it is somewhat speedy, i found it perfect for me. If someone is having problems, then moving to bsac is probably a good idea as the whole process takes a lot longer to complete, but chances are you'll need that time to build up your confidence in the water anyway.
Hmmm. I thought everyone had heard the joke about making a million pounds in diving... obviously not.
Sorry to sound a bit cynical but teaching diving for a living just doesn't make much money. Or so I've heard.
There's little of the big bucks available unless you own the business, even then...
Owning a dive shop might do it, but that's not purely teaching is it? You could do as well owning any other shop not even connected with diving.
Except that with owning a LDS you get to talk diving and mix with divers and maybe get discount kit and weekends away with people who decide you're a bit of a good egg.
If you're young and fancy free then you would indeed be best off diving somewhere exotic whilst you get your DM/whatever. That way, even though you don't make a lot of dosh, you're living the sun/sea/sand/diving/chicks thing and probably just about making enough to live on.
I know several people who have done the Red Sea/Maldives/Great Barrier Reef thing, teaching abroad... and none of them made big money at it. However they had a bl**dy good time finding out! Loads of free diving, a bit of work, being pretty skint all the time, but there wasn't a lot to spend any money on anyway except diving and beer, and they got the diving for free.
John Bantin is a millionaire of course, but he's the exception. :D
I of course, am the richest man in the world. :cool: But it depends how you measure your wealth. :)
hi, looks like i,ve found somebody that has experinced the same as me. i had panic attacks at the thought of mask clearance. i found padi was only interested in your money and after my second attempt of mask clearance was told that diving wasnt for me. since ive joined my local bsac club they have been wonderful and especially helpful with nervous divers. dont give up
Debbie
Well, I will be making millions out of diving ...... as soon as I have adapted the handle on my underwater metal detector (from ebay).
I have already planned much of my future and am currently finding out if my twin 12s fit in the boot of a Bugatti Veyron ..... if it has a boot?
I may even speak to you poor people occasionally - from my ivory keyboard on my private island ....... perhaps I'll buy the Galapogos ......... mmmmmmmmm ........ luxury. :)
ps: Pls note that conservation is for poor people, us rich 'uns don't need to worry about such things. I wonder if I can get any dolphin ivory for my keyboard? Well, I won't completely forget my "green" heritage ..... I'll try to use the whole dolphin ..... bottle nose on toast, fluke pie, blowhole and chips .........
:)
AndyDavis
17-07-2006, 14:18
I am a PADI diver and a member of BSAC.
Firstly, I should say that bad instruction is a product of a bad instructor, and not an indication of the agency concerned. All agencies have great, good and poor instructors. Such is life.
PADI can be notorious for rushing students through training. This is down to a single factor - money. A PADI instructor runs courses in order to make a living. A BSAC instructor in a branch, does it essentially as a hobby. Therefore, the PADI instructor has a vested interest in rushing through as many students as possible. This is most noticeable at holiday destinations, where time limits are strict - for both instructors and students alike.
However, a PADI instructor should also care that his students become capable divers and enjoy the courses that he teaches. Again, this is good business practice, if nothing else, as recommendations from happy students will bring more business. As a consequence, most of the UK PADI instructors that I know are more than happy to work at their students pace, taking as many sessions as necessary. Some, however, won't...but a bad instructor is a bad instructor, regardless of organisation or agency.
Firstly, I would suggest that you take your instructor to one side and explain your concerns to them (if you haven't already). Tell them what you would like and agree a timetable for YOUR needs. Be aware that most students feel 'overloaded' during training, but that is normal and simply a product of the strange environment you are learning to operate in. Many students will be pulling their hair out initially, but having qualified look back with amazement at how their progressed so rapidly. There, however, is a fine line between deliberate fast-paced instruction and skimming a course disregarding a student's needs.
If your instructor will not accomodate you, then you can consider changing. If you are happy to stay with PADI, then find a more suitable alternative instructor and investigate the likelihood of getting a partial refund and a REFERAL from your current instructor. This way, you will get some money back (as you have not completed the entire course) and you will get some credit for any of the skills/dives that you have already completed. If your instructor refuses to refund you, then you should contact PADI about your reservations and also contact Trading Standards (if you feel that the course is not of sufficient quality to accomplish what it is advertised to do - namely to make you a competent and safe diver).
You can consider immediately dropping the course and changing organisations, but that would mean a huge loss of money for you. If you finish the Open Water course with PADI, you can always join your local BSAC branch as a qualified diver and then continue to dive and learn with them....which is a very nice option if you prefer non-intensive training and social friendly diving environment.
There's little of the big bucks available unless you own the business, even then...!
I of course, am the richest man in the world. :cool: But it depends how you measure your wealth. :)
Big buck + own business are not phrases I've put together recently. At least our employees get paid - can't remember the last time I got a pay packet. But yes measure your wealth in a different way and riches will be yours.
To get back to the thread and as someone else has already pointed out - its the instructor that makes a good or bad diver, not the system.
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