Taking kids snorkelling

[Badders (Dave)]

I've got two lad who both come to the pool with me on dive club nights. I'm currently doing OD so I don't give them much attention, but I do know they love it, they would love to have a go at scuba but aren't old enough yet, their swimming skills have gone from abysmal to strong in just 2 months! the pool is split in two one 1/2 for SCUBA, the other 1/2 for swimming and Snorkeling.

We've been going since mid feb, I know that they were shown some basics. You know clearing the snorkel, surface diving etc at the beginning and they have taken it on board I think.

I've sorted them out with a mask, snorkel and fins. oh, they are 8 and 10 & both big lads.

The question is this. What do I do next with them, if anything? Leave them to just enjoy them selves a bit ?or is there some sort of intervention I should take to better their endeavors and stop bad habits forming?

Badders


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This thread split from "What do snorkellers want" -- Admin

[Ben Panter]

Hi Dave,

Technique-wise, ask one of the instructors to have a look at their finning style and perhaps offer some corrective instruction. Not too much you can explain over an internet forum, but any competent instructor should be able to help you - if you have a snorkel instructor in your branch then so much the better.

IMHO the most important thing though is to keep them interested. In the pool this could involve exercises like taking off the fins, mask and snorkel then retreiving them and putting them back on, or maybe a treasure hunt for keys etc. with a blacked out mask (under supervision for safety). The next step is to take them out in the sea - snorkelling is very under-rated in the UK, but we have some great sites. If you ever head up to the farnes for diving then take them with you - snorkelling with seals is incredible....

cheers,

Ben

[Badders (Dave)]

Thanks Ben. I think some one went through finning action with them, but only very briefly with the basic stuff and since then I bet they haven't bothered to practise doing it properly! I'll check. since then they 'snorkel' around in the pool, at the moment they are really into it. The keeping them interested ideas you've posed look really good and I think they'll help, I'd never in a million years have thought about involving them in the sea (I mean other than from a beach with a bucket and spade) and swimming with Seals 'wow' they'd love that, when I'm up and running properly I'll ask the club, what a great way to get them interested for the long term. Thanks these are some really good ideas.

Badders

[Ben Panter]

No worries Dave - some thoughts on taking the kids out for snorkelling (which hopefully a snorkelling instructor will add to / correct in the fullness of time) based on my own experience:


Get them wetsuits and teach them about being everso slightly buoyant with a weight belt. Provides warmth and as long as they know how to ditch the weight belt emergency floatation
Keep them warm. This is of particular concern on boat trips and the like - nothing puts you off more than being cold and miserable! This may well include changing out of the suits, and certainly lots of easily digestable food to sustain their higher metabolism.
See if anyone in your club have an old ABLJs with crackbottles. I'm not sure if this is the preferred solution among snorkellers, but I use one myself in case of problems and it's a good, cheap start. Any problems on the boat and they'll float head up and out the water.
Probably don't need to mention this, but make doubly sure that your branch is happy with them coming on trips with you. Probably best to start this after you've finished your training when you've got more time to look after them without being distracted from what you're there for!


Best of luck, I'm sure there are others about who can help more.

Ben

[Badders (Dave)]

Thanks again Ben. I'll do exactly as you have suggested.

Badders

[Neil R]

No worries Dave - some thoughts on taking the kids out for snorkelling (which hopefully a snorkelling instructor will add to / correct in the fullness of time) based on my own experience:

Hi Ben not a bad start,


Get them wetsuits and teach them about being everso slightly buoyant with a weight belt. Provides warmth and as long as they know how to ditch the weight belt emergency floatation

" Surgest Semi Dry Suits 7mm two peice , for snorkelling in british waters alot warmer " Neil r


Keep them warm. This is of particular concern on boat trips and the like - nothing puts you off more than being cold and miserable! This may well include changing out of the suits, and certainly lots of easily digestable food to sustain their higher metabolism.
See if anyone in your club have an old ABLJs with crackbottles. I'm not sure if this is the preferred solution among snorkellers, but I use one myself in case of problems and it's a good, cheap start. Any problems on the boat and they'll float head up and out the water.

" ABLJ's are great but once they've gained experiance a snorkel vest is a good thing to move onto less cumbersome.
Another thing is a line cutter and also a SMB and a reel. This is for safety, so you know where they are and the Marshel on site can see them and also if the get tired they've got something bouyant to hold onto. " Neil r


Probably don't need to mention this, but make doubly sure that your branch is happy with them coming on trips with you. Probably best to start this after you've finished your training when you've got more time to look after them without being distracted from what you're there for!


Best of luck, I'm sure there are others about who can help more.

Ben

Also see if any of the instructors at your club are snorkel instuctors and ask to see if they'll take your lads through the Snorkel Course's they'll have to join bsac as a snorkelling member i think £14 a year .

Good luck

Neil :)

[Daniology]

May I also suggest for those cold winter nights underwater hockey/Octopush some clubs have a junior section.

http://www.gbuwh.co.uk/boa.asp


I see Neils club has a team :)

[Gordon]

If youre going to take them snorkelling in the sea, get them wetsuits (like Ben said keep them warm).
I went snorkelling with my Dad near Oban at Easter before I had a wetsuit and came out blue, was good fun at the time but wouldnt do it twice...

[Badders (Dave)]

Thanks for that Neil, and Daniologi.
When I first joined the club I was encouraged to bring the lads and It was mentioned about a snorkel part to the club costing £14,
This hasn't been mentioned since, in all fairness I think the club has been all hands to the pump completing all the new diver courses in time for the warmer weather. Ive been rather preoccupied myself with my own training.
When things quieten down a bit and I've finished O.D. I'll ask, perhaps it's something I could even learn to assist with myself, as I have a vested interest with my own kids being involved, rather than just palming them off on someone else

Badders

Added Thanks Gordon they will like that ' nice kit'
where do you get good priced kids wet suits from? They grow so quickly I wouldn't want to spend to much.

[Geordie_cy]

Underwater Frisbee

[Daniology]

The ones I know of are Gul, Beaver and Decathalon.

http://www.beaversports.co.uk/

http://www.decathlon.co.uk/EN/Product_arborescence/Watersports/Diving/Snorkeling/Snorkeling_wet/index.html

You could also try searching some of the for sale lists and some shops like RoHo have a second hand section. The chances are with a kids wetsuit they'll have grown out of it before they've fully trashed it. But then some kids can trash things in minutes ;)

[Dave (Simmo)]

Hi Badders

also try ebay if your sure of the sizes my lad rising 8 goes through them very quickly so we sell the old and buy another - and if it's slightly big it'l do next time.

they can snorkle when your on holiday at tintagel. if you walk down asthough to go to king arthur's castle at the bottom of the hill [you havent paid yet] is the cove - ideal sheltered with an island in the centre you sometimes get Seal playing around the island - but you'll be lucky to get near one they're shy

also beware the tides in north cornwall tidal range is up to 9m so when it goes out it really goes out.

simmo

[Badders (Dave)]

Nice. I'll keep replying to stuff on here because its only polite as you've taken the time.:)

An under water Frisbee great idea I never heard of one until now! I have seen recently in my local dive shop an underwater torpedo and as you've mentioned this it looks like real fun. :) Thanks Gordon

Beaver sport looks real good. The prices are looking very keen also a new kids wet suit for under £20 seems V. Good. Thanks Dani.:D :D

Nice thought Dave. I've just had a look on eBay and I recon Id save a fortune if I just bought dry suits and dressed the lads in them all the time, for school etc. I could get the right size and they would be warm and snug, all for about £10-15, they look very hard-waring as well. Thanks.:rolleyes:

You know I'm obviously looking forwards to diving myself, soon and all that stuff, I never really thought that diving would present such a great opportunity to do something with the kids that they actually like, it will be interesting to see how this pans out.

Badders

[Bob Healey]

Just a couple of points, I would tend to go for 7 mm Semi-Dry suits for UK waters, thats what we kit our kids out in, wet suits tend to be a bit cold at least with semi-drys you can stay in longer and do more than one dive. Avoid Dry suits unless you are an experienced snorkeller, inversion when snorkelling is more of a problem than it is when scuba diving, you run out of air quicker.

We use ABLJ's on the first couple of times in open water, it's easy to crack open the bottle in case of panic or other problems, but they are bulky and make surface dives difficult unless they've got the technique perfected in the pool. We quickly move on to snorkelling vests, these are ideal, cheap and easily orally inflated.

We've found that Decathlon as cheap, if not cheaper, than most places for good quality semi-dry suits.

Bob

Good luck to both of them, it will certainly make it easier for them to learn scuba if they can master snorkelling first.

[Badders (Dave)]

Just a couple of points, I would tend to go for 7 mm Semi-Dry suits for UK waters, thats what we kit our kids out in, wet suits tend to be a bit cold at least with semi-drys you can stay in longer and do more than one dive. Avoid Dry suits unless you are an experienced snorkeller, inversion when snorkelling is more of a problem than it is when scuba diving, you run out of air quicker.

I have seen there are different gauge wet suits around I'll keep my eyes open for 7mm
I don't think dry suits would be financially agreeable with our D.F.O (Diving funds officer) 'AKA my wife' anyway. But a cheap semi dry would be nice!

We use ABLJ's on the first couple of times in open water, it's easy to crack open the bottle in case of panic or other problems, but they are bulky and make surface dives difficult unless they've got the technique perfected in the pool. We quickly move on to snorkelling vests, these are ideal, cheap and easily orally inflated..

I can guess that an ABLJ is a self inflating life jacket, I've seen it referred to earlier in this thread, out of interest what dose 'AB' stand for?

Good luck to both of them, it will certainly make it easier for them to learn scuba if they can master snorkelling first


Thanks for the tips Bob. Like I said although they've got snorkel, mask and fins, also a bit of a basic talk for a play around the pool. I don't want to pester the club until things quieten down a bit, (they had about 12 students in the pool last week at different levels this tied all the instructors and experienced divers up heavily) and until after I've finished OD, at that point I can also offer my help in some capacity.
I'll keep you posted as things develop.

Badders

[Ben Panter]

Adjustable Buoyancy Life Jacket

There's a big list of acronyms in the BSAC Diving Wiki (http://www.bsacforum.co.uk/wiki) specifically in the Diving Abbreviations (http://www.bsacforum.co.uk/wiki/index.php?title=Diving_Abbreviations) section

[Badders (Dave)]

Thank you Ben that will help a lot. You guys seem to use lots of acronyms

Badders

[Gordon]

Id look in decathlon for wetsuits.
Or see if anyone in the clubs selling an old one.
I got a nice 5mm suit for £20 because it was just taking up space in the guys garage.
Push of Wars are fun in the pool. Face each other and press the palms of your hands onto the other guys hands. Then fin like crazy. Worth getting the finning right first, or you end up reinforcing bad habits.

[Geordie_cy]

An under water Frisbee great idea I never heard of one until now! I have seen recently in my local dive shop an underwater torpedo and as you've mentioned this it looks like real fun. :) Thanks Gordon

http://www.bsacsnorkelling.co.uk/shop/accs.htm

[Badders (Dave)]

I had a look at the BSAC Frisbee that you put a link for, it looks like a lot of fun. Is that the right price though £25? seems a bit steep.

Badders

[Alison Boler]

Dave,
Now that summer's coming up it's worth having a look in places like the larger Tescos and Asda or large garden centres for swimming pool toys and games. We bought a set of brightly coloured weighted "sticks" which were really great for chucking in and having competitions to see who could retrieve the most, or put them into different depths for surface diving practice. You can also get other things like this eg weighted rings and hoops.

In the swimming pool, you can obviously work on shared skills like finning, different sorts of entries, surface dives but you can also do things to build water confidence like - swimming widths or lengths with the snorkel in but the mask off and eyes open. Or put them in a pair and have them swim a length passing each other the snorkel. This can be varied by having them seperated or holding arms. Teach them snorkelling forward and backward rolls - kids find these annoyingly easy!!!
Put bcds on them and let them try to inflate them while treading water. Try taking the bcd off and putting it on again while treading water with the snorkel in. Try taking the bcd off and then inflating the bcd fully and sitting on top of it like a raft!! :0

You can make all these sorts of things lots of fun - kids view them as more fun than an adult would especially if you make a bit of a game of it- and all the time they are gaining confidence but also picking up skills that will come in useful both as snorkellers and also as scuba divers later on.

When you take them out in the sea snorkelling, get a couple of those fish id cards and make a competition out of who can spot the most sorts of fish. Buy some of those little cream eggs and put them in a treasure hunt.

Anyway, keep them interested. They will add so much to your own diving/snorkelling enjoyment over the years, it will be well worth it.

Allie

[Geordie_cy]

I had a look at the BSAC Frisbee that you put a link for, it looks like a lot of fun. Is that the right price though £25? seems a bit steep.

Badders


Yeah you're right:
http://www.gltc.co.uk/ProductDetails.aspx?ProductID=G8667&CatID=Product&language=en-GB&esource=GGG01
http://www.paramountpools.co.uk/toys_and_games/aquadisc/Aquadisc_index.htm

Both seem to have the same thing for less than half the price

[Gordon]

We made some sinking rings from a length of flexible tubing and a straight connector (from B&Q). put connector in on end, fill with shot, connector on other end, gaffer tape round to stop coming undone. Then wrap colourful tape round it so you can see it.
Something else, if your kids are really good, is clearing your mask underwater in one breathe, or while theyre finning on the surface.

[Badders (Dave)]

Thank you all, some really good ideas coming across here. Alison I will keep my eyes open in these shops over the coming months if you ever come across something let me know please, it would be nice to find a bargain or at least some better prices for some wet games. In the mean time I'll make something, that's a good idea thanks Gordon , sounds simple enough to do. Even at £10 I think its a bit to much for a Frisbee you use in water, these shops are quite competitive though thanks for the links Geordie.

Another question on this topic, if I may. When I have time during club pool sessions, soon now, after I've finished OD. (I do intend doing SD straight away, but I'm under the impression that there isn't much in SD in sheltered water) I am quite keen to do something to better the kids enjoyment (pay for there snorkeling membership, if that's necessary) and get involved myself in some way. At the moment there are only my two kids really in that part of the pool so shouldn't cause me a problem, but long term Who would I talk to at the club, if one of you forum members are knowledgeable, what do I need to do on a official level to help out here or even in the absence of someone Else even teach snorkelling to the kids myself? (bearing in mind my only experience of snorkeling is what was covered in OD) Would I have to do a course or something? I presume a CRB check is needed? I am checked out quite regularly as I do a lot of volunteer work for the Police and Ambulance authorities.

[Ben Panter]

Hi Dave,

Lots of info on the BSAC Snorkelling site (http://www.bsacsnorkelling.co.uk/), including addresses for regional coordinators and advice on how to include snorkelling as a branch activity.

cheers,

Ben

[John Williams]

where do you get good priced kids wet suits from? They grow so quickly I wouldn't want to spend to much.

try
http://www.eastcoastmarine.co.uk

HTH

John

[Alison Boler]

Dave
Definitely your best bet would be to find a snorkelling branch/instructor in your vicinity - look on the snorkelling website that Ben has linked to, or post a message on the snorkelling bulletin board. Quite a few of the BSAC Snorkelling team are to be found there and they would be glad to help I'm sure.

Not sure where you live but you could also look out for a branch that is happy to teach kids - they will already have instructors in place and maybe they wouldn't be adverse to giving some snorkelling lessons. And you can certainly pass on what you have learned.

In some parts of the country, you will also find SSI shops (not to be advocating another agency obviously... but for information's sake :) ) that run Scuba Ranger clubs. These are clubs specifically for 8 - 12 year olds that take the kids, only in swimming pools, from swimmers through snorkelling and onto scuba. It's not a diver qualification and its also a bit like cubs or brownies in that they get lots of badges for doing tasks in the water or about marine life. All the kit is supplied by the club. The materials are excellent. So, if you haven't got a suitable BSAC club in your area, and there was one of these, its a good way of keeping the kids interested and moving along until they can start scuba training (if they want to of course) at 12 when they could come back to your branch.

On the wetsuits and kit etc, it is much easier these days to get kidsize stuff. Just make sure that the wetsuit is meant for watersports rather than the very cheap ones they sell to keep a child warm when swimming. The really cheap ones dont have proper seals around the necks, wrists and ankles and consequently they flush a lot and don't keep as warm. Kids tend to be skinnier than us adults :) and they feel the cold a lot quicker. Think what thickness of suit you would be prepared to wear and don't get one thinner than that as a minimum. The dive shows and the boat shows can be very good sources for decent cheap wetsuits - we've got our kids some there. Also - again, don't know where you live - but Robin Hood Watersports in Leeds always has a large selection of child sized suits.

Also, I would really advise you to get them strap fins and bootees at the point you move into the sea if you intend to snorkel anywhere other than a sandy beach. Their feet will get extra soft after being in the water for a long time and then if they have to take shoe fins off and get up a pebbly beach they will not be very happy at all!!! :)

Anyway, good luck with it all.

Allie

[Badders (Dave)]

Thanks for the info Alison

I'm in north staffs and a new member of Newcastle staffs S.A.C, I joined the club because a mate took me for a try dive and I loved it. The reason the kids got involved (ones 8, ones 10) is because the club encourages members to bring their kids along to play in a part of the pool. I am under the impression the there is a snorkel club, but I think everyone who deals with that is just busy at the moment, finishing off training people for the summer season, after the rush I guess the people who deal with the snorkeling will appear, if they do I would like to assist in some way rather than just feeling like I'm just dumping my kids on someone.
Badders

[Bob Healey]

Make sure that the suits you buy your kids are semi-dry suits, they are the ones with wrist and ankle seals. They usually have the hood attached, normally two piece so that the vital organs are doubly insulated. The seals stop the water flushing through whereas wet suits don't have good seals, if any, so they continually have cold water flushing through. Okay for Jet Skiing.

Bob

[Badders (Dave)]

Thanks Bob and John, A semi dry is probably the best, I have asked for some prices but price does comes into it, I wouldn't shove the kids into the sea in cold weather without the proper protection, as we probably won't be snorkeling outside until summer, would a cheaper dry suit do the job for now? because come late summer / autumn or next spring they'll probably be needing the next size up anyway.

Badders

[Neil R]

we probably won't be snorkeling outside until summer, would a cheaper dry suit do the job for now? because come late summer / autumn or next spring they'll probably be needing the next size up anyway.

Badders

Hi dave ,
semi dry is the best way forward , please don't buy a dry suit as you'll be wasting your money and unless your kids can get out of an inversion in a dry suit very dangerious.:eek:

The kids in our club all use semi dry suits 7mm with snorkel vest for the more advanced and ablj's for them just learning to open water snorkel.:D

[Badders (Dave)]

Sorry Neil i'm a pillack!!

Originally Posted by Badders (Dave)
we probably won't be snorkeling outside until summer, would a cheaper dry suit do the job for now? because come late summer / autumn or next spring they'll probably be needing the next size up anyway.

Badders

ooops sorry. I put the wrong word!!! I was supposed to say " would a cheap WET suit do the job"

Badders

[Gordon]

yes.

[Bob Healey]

If you are going to use wet suits keep the water time to shorter periods, the sea is still relatively cold even in summer, especially if you are laid in the water, inactive, watching something. Make sure there is a warm drink for them when they get out and something warm to go over their suits. Commonsense really. Kids seem to come out of the water complaining and the next thing they are running about the beach getting to hot anyway. Mmm can't win.

Just bear in mind the symtoms of hypothermia whilst they are in the water.

If you keep them finning as much as possible it usually helps to keep warmer.

Bob

[John Williams]

If you are going to use wet suits keep the water time to shorter periods, the sea is still relatively cold even in summer, especially if you are laid in the water, inactive, watching something. Make sure there is a warm drink for them when they get out and something warm to go over their suits. Commonsense really. Kids seem to come out of the water complaining and the next thing they are running about the beach getting to hot anyway. Mmm can't win.

Just bear in mind the symtoms of hypothermia whilst they are in the water.

If you keep them finning as much as possible it usually helps to keep warmer.

Bob

Make sure that they have some good hot food (that will provide a long-lasting energy source) before they go in the water...but leave at least an hour after eating before they get wet!

Keep an eye on lips (colour) and shivering (especially for it stopping)...they will deny being cold until they collapse!

In had mine out in open water yesterday and they did not last long ...especially the three-year-old.

(open water = the new above ground swimming pool I installed on Friday;) )

I was in my Red Sea all-in-one, full length wetsuit...they were in their shortie poolsuits! (so I was not able to compare them to me in any way shape or form...kids get cold quicker and mine had considerably less thermal protection!)

Helen, on the other hand had much more protection - her one-peice Red Sea Wetsuit (and her shortie pool-suit) stayed firmly in the garage ...and she stayed firmly in the heated conservatory!

She says she "might" get her wetsuits out (note the plural) in August!

But definately not in a Thunderstorm!

John

[SpeedDemon]

Hi Dave, what about showing them the equipment you have and show then how to assemble and disassemble it correctly, as well as why things are done. My nephews are 12 and 10 but are showing NO interest in diving:confused: , even when I offered Ricky (only just 12) a try dive for his birthday last month....he is more into skakeboarding :eek:

[clockwork]

There are one-piece jumpsuits made especially for kids, you might want to check that out. More infor here: Guide to Kids Wetsuits (http://pickyguide.com/sports_and_recreation/kids_wetsuits_guide.html)

[Badders (Dave)]

Thanks for the info clockwork.
You are new here so welcome.
Why not put a post onto the introductions thread and tell us all a bit about yourself, I look forward to reading it.

Badders