Weight Systems

[John S]

Hi All,

I am looking for a little advice again.

I have just returned from my first trip which was at the Farne Islands and as a novice diver (don't laugh) i lost my weight belt, Oceanic 5 pouch belt with approx 10kg, in it and yellow in colour if anyone finds it you just got about £100 worth, or you could be nice and message me and i will organise collection and reward.

So as a clumsy kind of fellow what do you think of:

A similar belt, shot or pouch N.B I don't like webing belts i find them very uncomfortable.

A harness type with quick release weights.

or

A Intergrated bcd similar to Mares Prestige MRS

Thanks John s

[MikeTonge]

How did you loose the weight belt? Might help us to suggest other options if necessary.

Personally I don't like any of the weight pockets or integrated weight solutions as I've both seen people loose a pocket whilst diving since they didn't stay in very well or try and ditch them during emergency drills and have a massive struggle to remove the pockets (normally due to the amount of lead they've got in them been close to the maximum they're supposed to take).
I would strongly recommend borrowing a set from someone in your club (or local area) to try before going and buying a set.

Mike

[John S]

Ok Mike I lost my belt by simply loosing my grip (it felt like i was watching the finial scenes in titanic watching jack dissapear deeper and deeper haha) it is something they have warned me about on several occassions whilst training, But these things can happen. So i was thinking that if i try and get something that would eliminate this happening again

[PeteM]

Ok Mike I lost my belt by simply loosing my grip (it felt like i was watching the finial scenes in titanic watching jack dissapear deeper and deeper haha) it is something they have warned me about on several occassions whilst training, But these things can happen. So i was thinking that if i try and get something that would eliminate this happening again

So presumably as you were gripping it rather than having it around your waist you were handing up to the boat? If so then the same problem can happen with any weight system, you have it in your hand ready to pass up and it can slip.

I've got a couple of mates that have a lanyard going from their belts to the BCD to make sure they can not loose the belt at depth, when rib diving you do not release the lanyard until the person on the boat has confirmed they have the belt.

[John S]

Yes Pete your right i was passing it onto the boat, or should i say i was trying to pass it onto the boat haha.
I was saying to my wife before i put this post on, That if there was some sort of lanyard that would hold the weight if dropped then that would do with the same sort of belt. Rather than buying a different set up.
Have your mates bought the lanyards or are they a homemade invention so to speak? I haven't looked into the possability of these yet so i don't know what is available

John s

N.B
Sorry I have seen them know so ignore that question Pete

[PeteM]

Yes Pete your right i was passing it onto the boat, or should i say i was trying to pass it onto the boat haha.
I was saying to my wife before i put this post on, That if there was some sort of lanyard that would hold the weight if dropped then that would do with the same sort of belt. Rather than buying a different set up.
Have your mates bought the lanyards or are they a homemade invention so to speak? I haven't looked into the possability of these yet so i don't know what is available

John s

N.B
Sorry I have seen them know so ignore that question Pete

Just to confirm all my mates have made their own

[Mike Halligan]

Simple. As described, a lanyard looped round a weightbelt between fixed points and clipped onto a D ring remedies the technique failure.

I've done it, you've done it, who's not done it? Investing in elaborate harnesses, pouches, double releases and so on does nothing to remedy brain-fade.

I very much support Pete's approach.

[John S]

I am investigating some more.
I do need to buy a new belt though and with what you are suggesting i may just go for a shot belt rather than a pouch belt and rig a lanyard up.

john s

[Edward]

Ok Mike I lost my belt by simply loosing my grip (it felt like i was watching the finial scenes in titanic watching jack dissapear deeper and deeper haha) it is something they have warned me about on several occassions whilst training, But these things can happen. So i was thinking that if i try and get something that would eliminate this happening again

I always teach students to hold the buckle end, its less likely to slip through your hand whereas the other will just disappear. If you fit a lanyard don't have it attached whilst diving unless it has a quick release or your buddy might not be able to get rid of it in an emergency.

Regards

Edward

[PeteM]

If you fit a lanyard don't have it attached whilst diving unless it has a quick release or your buddy might not be able to get rid of it in an emergency.

I on the other hand would recommend having it attached during a dive. One of the biggest dangers is loosing a weight belt at depth and doing a polaris missile ascent, I doubt there are many experienced divers that have not seen it happen or almost happen. Because of this just about everyone I dive with has a double action release for the weight belt to avoid that. Obviously you must explain this in the buddy check.

[Edward]

I wondered how long it would be before the other option was presented.

Both work with their specific advantages/disadvantages.

Regards

Edward

[micromouse]

If you dont like the webbing belts, consider a rubber belt... mine came from 0 three. Similar in use to a webbing belt, but easier to tighten up before the dive, and they contract at depth. The rubber is also less likely to slide around.

I'm at the Farnes in a couple of weeks, so will keep an eye out :-)

Wayne

[Nigel Hewitt]

I use a weight belt (a pocketed thing) when diving from a RIB because integrating it make the rig a beast to lift out of the water and I'm the guy underneath pushing if they drop it.

On a hard boat dive it's mostly bolted on because it's far kinder to my back.

Best of both worlds.

[Alan Prior]

I think it very much depends on how much weight you are wanting to carry. Up to about 12kg and I'll wear a weight belt with shot pouches as these conform better to your body shape. Lead blocks are OK for the pool but damned uncomfortable in open water. Any more than 12kg and I'll wear a harness as the quick release pouches have rings which you can pass up to the crew so less likely to slip out of your hands.

Skippers tend not to like weight integrated as lifting them out of the water or loading onto a boat can give them a hernia. They are heavy anyway.

One other option is to get a twinset - in which case you probably won't need a weight belt :D

[northern_diver]

Personally i love my weight harness. So will put my thoughts down...

1-weight distribution on body-more evenly, over the shoulders and back, not the hips and such where it can be often uncomfortable i'm told. More comfortable in my experience and so im told by others for general movement/sitting.

2-prevents weight slippage-as we decend, the weight belt often needs to be re fixed to prevent slipping off, especially i found in a drysuit, the shoulder straps keep it up.

3-grab handle-if you pull the 2 weight pockets out and hand them to the RHIB maste/toss them in (whatever) then the cox/helper can use the harness to grab you and help you in/also very handy if your pasted out/dead and in a rescue.

4-Weight distribution-If you lose a weight belt, you lose it all (99% of the time) if you lose a harness insert, you lose half. So while that isnt enough to stop a rapid ascent, it will be slower and might give you more of a change to save yourself. Also, if/when replacing a insert, you just have to replace half your lead+usually £14 for a insert so a little saving normally.

5-ease of donning-just toss them over your shoulders and if you facy clsoe the buckle, not actually needed, though people do, rather than put on/bend, pull etc etc...see 2

6-cost-generally about (at the cheapest end-which is quite suitable quality still) 4 times the cost of a weight belt (£10 weight belt new compared to say the northern diver weight harness, arounf £40) But i think easily worth that.

So i think they are generally much easier to wear, to don, to doth safely and generally a more safe setup all to gether.

As suggested, do some try out dives with the different set ups and see.

John

[John S]

Yet again every one is giving there own valid reasons for the system they use and i would like to thank you for this.

Micromouse :- Yeah that would be great if you have a look, although i do doubt you will find it as we were over a lot of kelp, but i will keep my fingers crossed.

[touchwood]

I agree with northern_diver above. I started diving a couple of years ago and, like a lot of people, began in a semi-dry suit. It was an Icelandic and with both layers on was 14mm which was great in the cold of winter but I had an experience that I vowed never to repeat. We were diving in Donegal Bay and I was in my 14mm suit with a weight belt tightly fastened around my waist (or it was when I left the RIB) but, when we got to about 18 metres my neoprene suit compressed so much that the belt loosened and I just managed to grab it as it descended past my knees! Luckily I was diving with a very experienced diver who saw what was happening and managed to jam me under a rocky ledge while he refitted my belt.

I swore I would never use a weight belt again and the next day ordered a Northern Diver harness which I've worn since without any hassle. I have yet to encounter a negative side to using a harness and it has all the plus points that northern_diver mentioned above.

The only thing I'd recommend is to fit something stiff into the pockets to prevent them bending. I need 12kg of lead and use 4 blocks of 3kg and the trouble was that without something stiff the pockets were able to bend and fall out of their pouches. This isn't a huge proglem in itself as the pockets are still attached to the harness but a pain in the arse nonetheless! A stiff bit of flat plastic like a cut up bit of square drainpipe cured this.

[ChristianG]

I generally dive (when in Oz) in a 5mm single piece semi-dry. In that suit I either use a 7.7 litre, 26 MPa (WP), steel tank with 3 litre aluminium pony or 2 x those steelies. In single tank (+ pony) mode I need 2 x 3 kg lead shot pouches. In twin tank mode I need no weight at all.

In my DUI shell suit I need 2 x 2kg lead shot pouches in single + pony tank mode (to be a tad overweight) and the same in twin tank mode, again, to be a tad overweight. Those last two are, of course, dependent on the amount of insulation under the shell suit, usually a DUI Thinsulate Jumpsuit which they claim to be good for 50-65 F (10-18 C), plus underbooties.

In the warm Pacific I don't use thermal insulation, therefore no weight belt and no BCD since they're unnecessary. Oh, I then also use an al tank (+ pony or twins) rather than a steel one.

If using weights my primary concern is that they stay put. I consider that the ditching of weight is an absolute last resort designed to make recovery of my body easier - no more, no less.