Inflatable - am I mad??

[Graham B Bowers]

Hi
I'm thinking (just thinking, mind!!) of a 5m inflatable +40hp engine.

Rationale is:
Lighter & cheaper than a rib.
Easier tow, storage & launch.

Requirements:
4 Divers
Inshore sites.

I used to cox & dive from a 5.8m Tornado in my last club 30 minutes from the NE England coast. I never tried an inflatable, but am now in the Midlands and without access to a rib.

Am I mad? Anybody in here still use inflatables or have anything good to say about them?
Any recommendations?

Cheers
Graham

[Andy Wade]

Hi
I'm thinking (just thinking, mind!!) of a 5m inflatable +40hp engine.

Rationale is:
Lighter & cheaper than a rib.
Easier tow, storage & launch.

Requirements:
4 Divers
Inshore sites.

I used to cox & dive from a 5.8m Tornado in my last club 30 minutes from the NE England coast. I never tried an inflatable, but am now in the Midlands and without access to a rib.

Am I mad? Anybody in here still use inflatables or have anything good to say about them?

Gosh, real rufty tufty diving!
You do realise that this means that you'll have to exert yourselves?
Limited range, but you know that.
Some of my most enjoyable diving was from inflatables.
It's nice when shore diving to have boat cover and for quick pick ups and ferrying out to sites that are a bit far to swim, you can't beat it. Cheap and cheerful.
One pair in one pair out, easy peasy.
You could always pool resources if there are other boats on site, it's great to take turns covering for each other and gives more freedom for those not actually diving and the satisfaction that others are watching out for you. Hey you might even make some friends, and have an impromptu beach BBQ.
I'm sure a lot of people who have only ever dived hard boats with nice friendly skippers putting them straight on to wrekcs will be gasping at the thought of the effort to find sites and actually driving a boat, but I'd say don't knock it until you've tried it.
I bet Dave Noble will be going Urgghhh!
Just joking Dave :-))



.

[Tony Dwyer]

Hi
I'm thinking (just thinking, mind!!) of a 5m inflatable +40hp engine.

Rationale is:
Lighter & cheaper than a rib.
Easier tow, storage & launch.

Requirements:
4 Divers
Inshore sites.

I used to cox & dive from a 5.8m Tornado in my last club 30 minutes from the NE England coast. I never tried an inflatable, but am now in the Midlands and without access to a rib.

Am I mad? Anybody in here still use inflatables or have anything good to say about them?
Any recommendations?

Cheers
Graham

Go for it!

I own a Zodiac Futura which is pushed by a Mariner 25 outboard.
Loads of fun.

Unload from trailer, lay it out, connect up the spare cylinder to the specially fabricated hose. Instant boat! Two people can carry it but four is better. It has detachable transom wheels so one person can wheel it about and launch it with the engine fitted.

Some pics, with the small 4 hp motor, pratting about doing inshsore training at Swanage.

<a href="http://www.basildonsubaqua.com/swanage%20gallery%20frame.htm" >http://www.basildonsubaqua.com/swanage%20gallery%20frame.htm</a>

Goes like stink when lightly loaded and is used on inshore dives as safety cover and for ferrying divers a little further out.

The grey Zodiac in the pics (see URL above) belongs to my branch. That is a little bigger and has a 35 hp motor. The two boats complement each other nicely.

They really come into their own in places like Swanage Bay.

I love mine to bits.

[Helen Butcher]

How much cheaper is it, and what would be the max offshore distance people would go in one?

Just for comparison - we have a RIB, but im interested in the cost difference now!

[Dave Woodward]

Do it, Why not, they are cheap, easy to get on with unless everyone is lazy, and at the end of the day you feel like you've had a days diving!!

I think you know Newcastle, where in a RIB you would launch at Shields and head up the coast, with the squidgy we could drive closer and haul it over the beach or whatever slip there is. Also you can let it down a bit and squeeze into most garages. At Newcaste Uni we had what was apparently a special humber squidy that was really wide. At a push with the 40 on it, we had done 6 divers (bends in the middle sometimes in rough seas, bt even more fun!). And if you want to go off shore, there are always hard boats.
Load of people seem to swear by Zodiac, but to honest don't know who makes squidgys now.

Dave

Hi
I'm thinking (just thinking, mind!!) of a 5m inflatable +40hp engine.

Rationale is:
Lighter & cheaper than a rib.
Easier tow, storage & launch.

Requirements:
4 Divers
Inshore sites.

I used to cox & dive from a 5.8m Tornado in my last club 30 minutes from the NE England coast. I never tried an inflatable, but am now in the Midlands and without access to a rib.

Am I mad? Anybody in here still use inflatables or have anything good to say about them?
Any recommendations?

Cheers
Graham

[Andy Wade]

How much cheaper is it, and what would be the max offshore distance people would go in one?

Just for comparison - we have a RIB, but im interested in the cost difference now!

Ok I'd say about 5 miles would be a fair limit, but that's just my opinion.
Farnes is certainly do-able in a floppy. So are the Summer Isles, and quite a bit of Anglesey. For instance.
Bear in mind also that they can be a fair bit wetter than a RhIB and shiny things like gps and echo sounders can get soaked, so you'll need to watch the expensive kit.
Less room if it's a smaller boat, Like Tony has said, loads of fun, easy to transport if you have an estate or similar, no need for a trailer to launch it. I've even launched over rocks because two or more can carry them. Save on launching fees too.
Can be very bumpy in rough seas of course, it just doesn't cut through the waves as well, but hey.
If there's enough of you in the group, you can use two boats and moor one over the dive site and use the other to pick up and fetch divers back.
They are a lot cheaper and the engine is smaller, so you might struggle to plane if well loaded, a small Floppy with a 35ish HP engine can be handled fairly easily.
If you're interested in going further out than 5 miles then I'd say get a Rhib, but you'll probably have worked that out for yourself, (or hire a hardboat).
They are pretty fair weather diving boats but very versatile and great for getting to those hard to reach spots that the skipper won't take you.
Actually this has set me thinking about whether some dive sites are simply not dived any more because everyone breezes past them in hardboats and Rhibs in search of deeper virgin wrecks.
HTH.

.

[richard2338]

I have a 5m Chinook inflatable that is used extensively by our small branch in the absense of a club boat. This is highly sucessful and reliable despite the age of the hull (25 years and going strong!) I purchased a nearly new 40hp tiller engine for it a year ago, which makes for an extremely reliable and cheap boat.
For us, the inflatable fills the gap between shore diving and hard-boat diving nicely. No, it doesn?t have the range of the RIB, but if we want to go any distance offshore, the hardboat is the way to go for comfort and safety. However, hardboats cost ???, and many of our divers operate on a tight budget. The inflatable allows us to clock up a good number of boat dives with very low running costs.

The difference in price between RIB and inflatable? well, I have limited knowledge of purchase costs of 5m RIBs nowadays, but I would be highly surprised if you could get a half-decent 5m RIB + engine(s) + trailor for less than ?20k. And you can certainly spend an awful lot more. Whereas you will probably get a decent 5m inflatable plus 40hp tiller engine for around ?6k new. Heck of a price difference, despite the fact you are still getting a boat that carries 4 ? 6 divers to a lot of ?common? inshore dive sites.

Our 5m inflatable carries 4 divers with twinsets and a dedicated coswain comfortably. Or for shorter distances in good weather and lighter-kitted divers we can take 6 divers and a coswain with a reserve of horsepower. The other option is 6 divers, 2 of which are boathandlers, and staggering the diving pairs.

There are some areas of coastline which are inaccessible due to the limited range of the inflatable, however there are others which are even more accessible where slipways are limited. Areas we regularly dive from using the inflatable are: Swanage (Kyarra, Old Harry?s, Kimmeridge etc), Weymouth (Countess of Erne etc), Pembrokeshire (Dakotian, Greek, Lucy, Hen & Chicks etc), Selsey (Mulberries, Mixon Hole), Porthkerris, Farne Islands. Pretty standard basic branch dive sites.
None of the transit times to any of the above sites is longer than 15min-ish except the Farnes; I estimate our typical speed as 8 -10 kts. So normal range would be max. 4 miles.
I have a week long trip to the Sound of Mull planned for 10 divers in July using the inflatable and taking divers out in waves from the nearby shoreline. We plan to do all the major wrecks there.

Another benefit of an inflatable with increasing petrol prices is the ability to transport it around the country at little additional cost and with a degree of flexibility. You have two options: average car with towbar or van, instead of just a large car with a RIB. And the car is only pulling a relatively light load, so any average sized family car will probably be capable and legal to tow with. My 1.8litre car tows our inflatable very comfortably with little impact on fuel consumption. In fact, you have to keep reminding yourself its on the back! This issue of transportation of the boat to the dive-site can be a major factor in organising club dives in my experience.

Yes, diving with inflatable takes more planning. Finding the wrecks can be a challenge. Its not so easy to mount electronic equipment on an inflatable. We currently use handheld GPS to get us to the locality of the wreck, then transits. (Or hopefully it is already shotted!) I am looking into a portable echo-sounder at present, however, which should improve things. But diving from an inflatable, doing all the boat stuff yourselves somehow seems much more adventurous and exciting than hopping off a hardboat or big, smooth running RIB!

One possible advantage of a tiller boat over electronic ignition/ remote engines is reliabilty. In my experience of small boats, the most common cause of problems and breakdowns is the electrics onboard. In my book, a good diver?s boat will be the most reliable one, not necessarily the fastest!

One of the bigggest disadvantages with an inflatable is probably the launching/recovery which will generally require a number of people helping out. This can be a right pain, depending on how many people you have present and what size/arrangement of boat /trailor you go for. Modern inflatable hulls are considerably lighter than the one we use however, although this may come at the price of rigidity, hence carrying capacity.

Current manufacturers of ?large? ie 4 ? 5m inflatables are: Avon, Zodiac, Bombard (a slightly cheaper boat, made by Zodiac) and Yamaha. Other RIB manufacturers will make you an inflatable hull most probably, I approached Humber about this a few years ago and they said they could do, but had nothing ?off-the-shelf? so I am guessing this would be a more expensive option.

Go for it! They are the branch dive boat of the future!

[benpanter]

Load of people seem to swear by Zodiac, but to honest don't know who makes squidgys now.

Avon make them, in a very military grey colour!

The Edinburgh Uni club has two, no, three squggies which are used for diving all over Scotland. They're certainly not fast, but they get the job done and are easy to launch / recover. I'd say if you have the money, get a RIB - but don't discount the squiggies.

A good combination is what the Nottingham Uni used to do - a RIB to get to the site fast, set up the shot, start getting the slower divers ready etc. while the squiggie chugs out to meet them.

[cgsac]

What a great post, no politics or pesonality clashes. I have been thinking the same thing for a year or two now. Am I right in thinking there is a vibrant second hand market for small inflatables as well (tenders in marinas and yachties etc).

What I am interested in (or what scares me to be honest) is the engine side of things. Ie how big, how much to pay, run etc and how the hell do you maintain them. has anyone any ideas

IMHO this is the sort of thing that DIVE mag write about and review (or is that political).

Cris

[Graham B Bowers]

:
Hey you might even make some friends, and have an impromptu beach BBQ.

Extrapolates........

I'm sure a lot of people who have only ever dived hard boats with nice friendly skippers putting them straight on to wrekcs will be gasping at the thought of the effort to find sites and actually driving a boat, but I'd say don't knock it until you've tried it.

It's the independance that attracts me, must be my mountaineering background. :-))

.

[Graham B Bowers]

Richard
Thanks for a great post.
Do you have any tips on buying second hand please?
Cheers
Graham

[richard2338]

:=:
Hey you might even make some friends, and have an impromptu beach BBQ.

Extrapolates........

:=I'm sure a lot of people who have only ever dived hard boats with nice friendly skippers putting them straight on to wrekcs will be gasping at the thought of the effort to find sites and actually driving a boat, but I'd say don't knock it until you've tried it.

It's the independance that attracts me, must be my mountaineering background. :-))

:=.
Some other downsides... yes, you get the independence, which I also love, but there is, of course, responsibility with that. Fitting all the necessary safety equipment in a small inflatable (I'm thinking 3.8m - 4.2m here) can be difficult. Don't have much trouble with our 5m boat mind, however I've yet to determine how to fit a radar reflector to an inflatable! Any ideas would be appreciated! Solas V regs only state one should be fitted "where practicable" however.
Bear in mind you may be on your own on the sea and with limited navigational equipment. This should be reflected carefully in all your planning for each trip, and crew and boat kitted out suitably for what you are undertaking. Don't get too ambitious! These issues will probably require more careful thought than on a larger boat... 'crew endurance' in cold conditions for instance in your slower 'squidgy'...

[neil r]

I've yet to determine how to fit a radar reflector to an inflatable! Any ideas would be appreciated! Solas V regs only state one should be fitted "where practicable" however.

Problem solved curtasy ebay .
Inflatable radar reflector on a pole .

<a href="http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=90875&item=7151711589&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW" >http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=90875&item=7151711589&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW</a>

Neil

[richard2338]

What a great post, no politics or pesonality clashes. I have been thinking the same thing for a year or two now. Am I right in thinking there is a vibrant second hand market for small inflatables as well (tenders in marinas and yachties etc).

Well yes, there are plenty of second-hand tenders out there. But to go diving, you will probably need something bigger. A 'tender' in my book is normally an inflatable of up to 3.4m size perhaps. A realistic dive boat for 2- 4 divers starts at 3.8m - 4.2m and really needs to be 4.5m - 5m to be very practicable. To get the RIGHT inflatable for your needs in good working order on the second-hand market MAY be difficult. A brand new inflatable hull may only cost you ?2000 or thereabouts however, depending on size and fit-out of course.

What I am interested in (or what scares me to be honest) is the engine side of things. Ie how big, how much to pay, run etc and how the hell do you maintain them. has anyone any ideas

An inflatable for diving ie 4.5m - 5m really needs a 40hp to give enough horsepower to keep you out of trouble. Boats of 3.8m - 4.5m will be OK with a 25hp or 30hp.
Maintenance isn't as bad as you think, there are a lot less mechanical parts in an outboard engine than your car! Get some training, do a BSAC Boat & Engine course, find out what you can and can't do yourself. And getting an annual 'once-over' by the local dealer if you drop the engine into them may not be as costly as you think and will be sufficient to cover most routine maintenance issues. Its the problems at sea you need to think about how you would handle... Personally I prefer to spend the money on getting a good condition engine and paying someone to keep it in vgc, thus minimising my chances of a problem at sea. Which is, of course, just common sense and good practise.
If properly maintained, you would be unlucky to have a problem at sea. From my experience, many of the common breakdowns at sea revolve around dodgy electrics and remote steering. Your tiller engine avoids these common problem areas totally. Thats not to say you shouldnt be familiar with dealing with basic potential mechanical problems whilst at sea, and you still need a VHF radio and flares etc for worst-case scenarios!

IMHO this is the sort of thing that DIVE mag write about and review (or is that political).

Yes, I think it would be a great idea for a DIVE article, and interviewing some BSAC branches that regularly use them might be of interest as well. I understand there is a large branch north of me that operates 3 identical inflatables as their club boats in twos and threes. Would be interested to learn of their experiences almongst others. I think inflatable boats may be the way to reverse the decline in availability of branch diving boats as RIBs get more and more expensive. This may also promote more interest in BSAC branch diving.

Cant see how this could be political... but then it never ceases to amaze me what some people find political in BSAC! We are all just meant to be keen to go diving, and an inflatable boat is just another way of opening up the sport to people on a budget.

[richard2338]

I've yet to determine how to fit a radar reflector to an inflatable! Any ideas would be appreciated! Solas V regs only state one should be fitted "where practicable" however.

Problem solved curtasy ebay .
Inflatable radar reflector on a pole .

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=90875&item=7151711589&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW

Neil

Thanks very much Neil, I have placed a bid for it! Will give it a try and see how practical it is... provided none of you lot outbid me!

[dave covey]

Hi
I'm thinking (just thinking, mind!!) of a 5m inflatable +40hp engine.


....further to other replies I suggest you consider contacting an army surplus store & ask for an avon redcrest & johnson 40, I guess they'll have a few lying about, c/w spares & repair kit.

This link goes to the biggest MOD Surplus store I've ever seen-They'll even sell you a chieftain tank if you asked (they had one outside!!)

[TrevorM]

Go for it! They are the branch dive boat of the future!

Absolutely! There are the remnants of a discussion (see link below) we had in our club about buying a new boat - either replacing the ageing squidgy we had or getting a small rib. Arguments are still fairly uptodate - we ended up getting a Zodiac Grand Raid MKIII. They are great fun and very versatile - they're getting rolled up, put in a box and sent to the Scillies for a few weeks in August!

T

[Graham B Bowers]

Richard
Some of practical questions come to mind that I hope you or others could shed some light on.
If the inflatable is towed inflated on a boat trailer, is it stiff enough to bear the weight of the motor? If so, then it'll launch with the motor on, if using a slip.
If transporting rolled up, or launching by hand without a slip, how difficult is it to install the motor, which I guess won't be light?
Do you get an electrical supply for instrumentation, or do you use battery powered kit?
I guess we are in to a pull start here, as there won't be a starting battery??
Is there room on the transome for a donkey engine?
Is it usual to make a box for the pointy end to contain flares, anchors, sea anchor etc etc?
Is there a good way to break it to the missus???
Cheers
Graham

[Dave Woodward]

Here are a couple of picture of Newcastle Uni's Humber
<a href="http://www.societies.ncl.ac.uk/nusac/Pictures.htm" >http://www.societies.ncl.ac.uk/nusac/Pictures.htm</a>

It has a light A-frame to carry a couple of boxes for flares, tools, first aid and so on, a battery pack to run some nav lights and a radio, and a breadbox for anchor and shots in the bow.

Went OK on the trailer, but we had a support for the engine that attached into the back to the trailer and mounted the light board. Also at times, when space was available, we would put the engine in the back of a minibus and tow it lighter.

Two people can carry the engine easily and fit it once you have put the boat in the water. the motor literally slots on over the transom then you tighten the clamps up.

A hand held GPS, and sometime handheld radio was enough. you can get fishfinders that would fit as well.

Dave

Richard
Some of practical questions come to mind that I hope you or others could shed some light on.
If the inflatable is towed inflated on a boat trailer, is it stiff enough to bear the weight of the motor? If so, then it'll launch with the motor on, if using a slip.
If transporting rolled up, or launching by hand without a slip, how difficult is it to install the motor, which I guess won't be light?
Do you get an electrical supply for instrumentation, or do you use battery powered kit?
I guess we are in to a pull start here, as there won't be a starting battery??
Is there room on the transome for a donkey engine?
Is it usual to make a box for the pointy end to contain flares, anchors, sea anchor etc etc?
Is there a good way to break it to the missus???
Cheers
Graham

[Dave Gavens]

Hi,

our club is considering selling 2 old inflatables at the mo. if you are interested?

if you send your details to me at <a href="mailto:davidgavens@hotmail.com">davidgavens@hotmail.com</a> i'll let you know the decision and then send you some pics and info if we are selling.

Dave

[Graham B Bowers]

Hi,

our club is considering selling 2 old inflatables at the mo. if you are interested?

if you send your details to me at <a href="mailto:davidgavens@hotmail.com">davidgavens@hotmail.com</a> i'll let you know the decision and then send you some pics and info if we are selling.

Dave

Emailed..........