Do many people use this forum [Archive] - BSAC Scuba Diving Forums

Steve Pearson

12-09-2005, 01:22

pauls1149

12-09-2005, 07:39

I use this forum a lot - but dont post to it very often - if you have been following the forum you will see that it is being revamped.

Hows that for stimulating conversation?

Andy Wade

12-09-2005, 07:45

Do many people use this forum?

It seems like the same couple of dozen names regularly using it, with very little movement going on. Hardly anything has been posted for a week.

Perhaps a revamp of the forum format may be in order to make it more inviting and fun to post. After all with as many members as we have at BSAC you'd think we could get some interest and stimulating conversation going.

That's already being done. Keith and team are on with it. (see link)
I think an awful lot of people read the forums (I look every day), but interest in posting messages has waned in recent times. I don't know why.
Maybe everyone is on holiday?
The usual suspects are all talked out I guess. We've discussed every aspect of diving on here over the last few years, and apart from the odd new question here and there (mostly about training), diving hasn't fundamentally changed enough recently to introduce any really new concepts worthy of discussion that haven't already been discussed. (IMHO)

And the growth of other forums (fora?) has diluted interest here too.

Of course if Tom Hennessey wanted to open up a discussion about the '88' tables....

.

jackathan

12-09-2005, 19:17

I read it most days as well. I don't feel qualified to add to most of the articles but learn lots!

:=Do many people use this forum?
:=
:=It seems like the same couple of dozen names regularly using it, with very little movement going on. Hardly anything has been posted for a week.
:=
:=Perhaps a revamp of the forum format may be in order to make it more inviting and fun to post. After all with as many members as we have at BSAC you'd think we could get some interest and stimulating conversation going.

That's already being done. Keith and team are on with it. (see link)
I think an awful lot of people read the forums (I look every day), but interest in posting messages has waned in recent times. I don't know why.
Maybe everyone is on holiday?
The usual suspects are all talked out I guess. We've discussed every aspect of diving on here over the last few years, and apart from the odd new question here and there (mostly about training), diving hasn't fundamentally changed enough recently to introduce any really new concepts worthy of discussion that haven't already been discussed. (IMHO)

And the growth of other forums (fora?) has diluted interest here too.

Of course if Tom Hennessey wanted to open up a discussion about the '88' tables....

.

Keith Lawrence(BSAC)

13-09-2005, 09:10

Perhaps a revamp of the forum format may be in order to make it more inviting and fun to post. After all with as many members as we have at BSAC you'd think we could get some interest and stimulating conversation going.

We're working on it... we're working on it :-) Sorry for the delay, our new web servers are a bit behind schedule as I've had to divert resources to a more important HQ server upgrade that we've got going on as well. We're moving the forums to a customised vBulletin format (like YD) with loads of new features. They're running now on one of my servers just waiting for the new BSAC ones to come online and then I'll move them, once that's been done I'm going to ask you lot how you want it all set up.

We do always go quiet during the summer, my stats going back a few years show that, it normally starts picking up around now. But then we come to a more fundamental question of what do people /want/ from their forums?

Looking around at the two obvious ones of Divernet and YD you can see that Divernet has become Troll Heaven of late where they spend more time talking to the trolls than anything else. YD is a nice forum but complex, finding things is difficult, they also extend way outside of diving topics and the huge voume of posts they get often have nothing whatsoever to do with diving. There's nothing at all wrong with that if that's what people want - but is that what you want on the BSAC forums?

I'm easy on this, I'm only the club anorak who provides the facilities, so with our new forums coming online it's up to you how we set them up and use them.

Cheers

Keith L

Philip Smith

13-09-2005, 13:24

YD is a nice forum but complex, finding things is difficult, they also extend way outside of diving topics and the huge voume of posts they get often have nothing whatsoever to do with diving. There's nothing at all wrong with that if that's what people want -

Definitely not!

Keep it simple, please!

I don't mind if the forum is quiet -- it perks up every now and then; it's better than it being continuously filled up with drivel.

Phil.

Steve Pearson

13-09-2005, 13:57

You can't get much simpler than the current format.

YD is a good forum and a lot of stimulated discussion goes on mostly about diving. The new forum doesn't need to be as complicated as YD, but I feel that some useful forums should be as follows:

FAQ - Frequently asked questions
General Information
Personal ads - For sale/wanted
Dive Kit
Technical
Looking for Buddies
Dive trips planned
Boat places to fill
Dive reports
Skills training
Instructors area
Wrecks
Members List/contacts

There may be others to add as well, but I feel that to have forums covering these topics would make good interesting discussions/information. By having clearly defined categories it makes it easier to search for or get an answer to a question.

Also a New posts section would be useful to see what has been posted across all forums at a glance.

Steve

terryh

13-09-2005, 14:54

Bit of political history.

Quite a few years ago now the Labour party was a written off
as an electable force, leading to years of tory rule.

A lot of this can be put squarely at the door of confereneces
etc. where open debate turned into hostility. The electorate
saw a tory party that pretty much endorsed the leadership,
while Labour did its dirty washing in public.

Now the roles are reversed, with a cleaned up Labour party
that almost never talks about problems in public and a tory
outfit that squabbles like schoolboys.

Like all of us BSAC makes mistakes. As diving changes and
progresses we need to talk, discuss and argue points that
may seem insignificant to HQ, but very real to us at grass
roots. The standard methods of getting through to the heirachy
take too long, are diluted through time and eventually get
buried leading to more resentment.

So what better way than talk to HQ etc. through fora?

Rememember Labour and Tories?
The fora is seen as being not just individuals, but BSAC
individuals. comments made on it reflect what others think
about us and as in the past it becomes neccessary to protect
BSAC by having a form of censorship.

Trouble is that this stifles and squashes debate or in some
cases makes it more public and adversarial.

So what's the awnser?

We debate without censorship, thus falling into Labour's trap
of washing our linen in public or we censor posts to the point
where they become almost impotent.

This is why above else we need a part or section of the fora
which is resticted to current BSAC members and is uncensored
apart from the usual language bit.

Finaly we can then be honest and discuss real matters without
trolls or diversions and as it is very real, maybe get HQ etc.
to actually listen and respond without endangering there or
BSAC's position. Dirty washing maybe, but not in public.

TerryH

Keith Lawrence(BSAC)

13-09-2005, 16:12

FAQ - Frequently asked questions
Got them
General Information
Got that - an Announcement forum
Personal ads - For sale/wanted
Yup - forum for that as well
Dive Kit
That goes into 'general' until it needs a forum of its own
Technical
Got that
Looking for Buddies
Hmmm... not yet, we'll talk about that
Dive trips planned
As above?
Boat places to fill
Got that
Dive reports
See Travel Club, and you get a ?15 voucher :-)
Skills training
Got that
Instructors area
Got that
Wrecks
That goes into 'general' until it needs a forum of its own
Members List/contacts
Got that

There may be others to add as well, but I feel that to have forums covering these topics would make good interesting discussions/information. By having clearly defined categories it makes it easier to search for or get an answer to a question.

That's why I initially intend to KISS, you don't want a few posts rattling around a vast forest of forums, far better to have busy forums and then split things out as the demand is there.

Also a New posts section would be useful to see what has been posted across all forums at a glance.

Got that - all built into the software, as is a search function.

How did I do? :-)

Keith L

Keith Lawrence(BSAC)

13-09-2005, 16:31

...
So what's the awnser?

We debate without censorship, thus falling into Labour's trap
of washing our linen in public or we censor posts to the point
where they become almost impotent.

This is why above else we need a part or section of the fora
which is resticted to current BSAC members and is uncensored
apart from the usual language bit.

Finaly we can then be honest and discuss real matters without
trolls or diversions and as it is very real, maybe get HQ etc.
to actually listen and respond without endangering there or
BSAC's position. Dirty washing maybe, but not in public.

You just haven't been paying attention over the years have you Terry :-) I'll say it yet again... I have NEVER censored these forums, neither has anybody else whilst I've been around, neither will I let them. The day that I am instructed to censor these forums by a majority Council decision will be the day that a new Council member and a new IT Team Leader is needed - it's a simple as that!

But these forums are moderated, as is just about every other diving forum in the UK. I will not allow purile trolls, flame wars, slanging matches, insults, foul language, libel and the like. The only difference between here and other forums is that I'm open and honest about it, I don't just delete entire threads and posts and say nothing, I'm accountable. Sorry folks - that's the way it is going to continue as well! You'll only change it by changing me (not too long to wait now) and/or by majority Council decision.

OK, having established the difference between censorship and moderation to the point in hand : 'behind closed doors' so to speak. Yes, I've got that running as well. It needs a thorough test but I've got an automated system linking back to the HQ systems that allows BSAC members (and instructors) onto their own forums.

Am I still doing quite well with the "wish lists" ? :-)

Cheers

Keith L

David Walker

13-09-2005, 16:41

:=Looking for Buddies
Hmmm... not yet, we'll talk about that
:=Dive trips planned
As above?
:=Boat places to fill
Got that

See I always thought of these three as pretty much the same - just planned trips are more in advance than boat spaces or buddies. I'd go with one forum for all three personally... what if you're looking for people on a trip you've planned to buddy-up and help fill the boat?

:=Dive reports
See Travel Club, and you get a ?15 voucher :-)

Something i've always wondered... where does this ?15 come from? Seems an odd way to spend money when if you look at other places people will contribute trip reports for no reward, and are often of better quality (more information, more useful, etc) than some of those i've read on the BSAC Travel thing.

David

Steve Pearson

13-09-2005, 17:02

Hi Keith

You did pretty well.

The reason for some of them are as follow:

Planned dives - self explanatory, planned in advance giving good notice for booking onto a scheduled dive.

Boat places to fill - last minute posts by either a skipper or dive organiser a few days before the event as an attempt to fill any places.

Dive buddies wanted - an individual wanting a dive, but has no-one to dive with.

When will the new forum be due for launch.

Steve

Keith Lawrence(BSAC)

14-09-2005, 08:14

When will the new forum be due for launch.

Well... after MUCH revision of time scales (we've all been up-to-eyeballs in it!)... I'm hoping to have the beta version running with you lot testing and commenting on it around the end of next week. We'll run the two in parallel for a while, then when everybody is happy we'll switch them over.

I'll be looking for a team effort on this one - YOU lot are going to be the team and we'll set it all up how we all want it set up :-)

Cheers

Keith L

sharkbait

16-09-2005, 21:03

Do many people use this forum?

Never use it myself.

DOH!

MarkA

19-09-2005, 13:34

Do many people use this forum?

It seems like the same couple of dozen names regularly using it, with very little movement going on. Hardly anything has been posted for a week.

Perhaps a revamp of the forum format may be in order to make it more inviting and fun to post. After all with as many members as we have at BSAC you'd think we could get some interest and stimulating conversation going.

Thoughts please

What you must not do on this forum is be critical of the BSAC or point out any inconsistancies in standards. and the worst crimeof all is to try and have a bit of friendly banter with someone as aparently this gives visitors the wrong impression.
This will lead to you having your thread removed before other people can see it and be corrupted to trying this banter thing out for themselves

Steve

Vic

19-09-2005, 19:48

> What you must not do on this forum is be critical of the BSAC > or point out any inconsistancies in standards

That's completely wrong.

Many a time I've been extremely critical of BSAC on these fora. I have done my level best to embarrass the top brass so that they take note of things I think they should take note of.

Not once have I had any of my posts removed or altered.

> and the worst crimeof all is to try and have a bit of friendly
> banter with someone as aparently this gives visitors the wrong
> impression.

There's nothing wrong with friendly banter.

There's plenty wrong with ill-mannered postings that are later claimed to be "humour".

Vic.

MarkA

19-09-2005, 20:13

Sorry Vic
I know from experience it happens
Ask Keith

Perhaps you just have not hit the right nerve

as far as friendly banter being removed it was just that
not offencive and certainly not taken as such by the target of my jibes

> What you must not do on this forum is be critical of the BSAC > or point out any inconsistancies in standards

That's completely wrong.

Many a time I've been extremely critical of BSAC on these fora. I have done my level best to embarrass the top brass so that they take note of things I think they should take note of.

Not once have I had any of my posts removed or altered.

> and the worst crimeof all is to try and have a bit of friendly
> banter with someone as aparently this gives visitors the wrong
> impression.

There's nothing wrong with friendly banter.

There's plenty wrong with ill-mannered postings that are later claimed to be "humour".

Vic.

Vic

20-09-2005, 07:23

> I know from experience it happens

And I know from experience that it doesn't.

Whatever you had removed, you appear to be mistaken as to the reason for its removal.

HTH, HAND, etc.

Vic.

Keith Lawrence(BSAC)

20-09-2005, 08:40

Sorry Vic
I know from experience it happens
Ask Keith

...and Keith will tell you that your claim of "censorship" is complete and utter rubbish. Sing another song Mark, you are perfectly free to throw private insults at your mates, you're just not going to do it on here. If you don't like it then Divernet is that way >>>>>

Keith L

MarkA

20-09-2005, 08:41

> I know from experience it happens

And I know from experience that it doesn't.

Whatever you had removed, you appear to be mistaken as to the reason for its removal.

HTH, HAND, etc.

Vic.

Follow the link and see for yourself

MarkA

20-09-2005, 18:40

Short memory is it Keith

:=Sorry Vic
:=I know from experience it happens
:=Ask Keith

...and Keith will tell you that your claim of "censorship" is complete and utter rubbish. Sing another song Mark, you are perfectly free to throw private insults at your mates, you're just not going to do it on here. If you don't like it then Divernet is that way >>>>>

Keith L

Andy Wade

20-09-2005, 19:23

MarkA

20-09-2005, 21:07

Andy
Regards to you too
Mark

Andy Wade

20-09-2005, 22:06

Andy
Regards to you too
Mark

Hello Mark,
Do you know that since our last discussion I have made a point to read every single one of your posts?

;-)

.

MarkA

21-09-2005, 09:45

:=Andy
:=Regards to you too
:=Mark

Hello Mark,
Do you know that since our last discussion I have made a point to read every single one of your posts?

Andy
That has not kept you very busy then as there has not been many if any

Nice to know I have a guardian angel though
Cheers
Mark

Just Checked and there has only been ONE (link below)
not the most controversial thing ever written

Paul Renucci

03-10-2005, 00:15

Do many people use this forum?

It seems like the same couple of dozen names regularly using it, with very little movement going on. Hardly anything has been posted for a week.

Perhaps a revamp of the forum format may be in order to make it more inviting and fun to post. After all with as many members as we have at BSAC you'd think we could get some interest and stimulating conversation going.

Thoughts please

Sadly, if we all had more free time to post messages on BSAC's forums some might argue the opposite, but I do read with great interest what everyone is saying on the forum and my guess is that there are a great many in the same position but who don't have time to add their thoughts.

Truth is that some of us (probably a great many) are too busy organising or actually diving on the weekends to be that concerned about posting messages.

The last time I even had time to read the forum was six month ago - except for tonight after getting all the shops paper work done.

Paul at Freshwaterdiver,com

jackathan

03-10-2005, 09:59

that's the beauty of these forum.
never considered a trip to the lake district. don't bother with the quarry's except for training as live close to the coast. but the idea of a weekends freshwater diving for a change sounds good.

will add this to are list - also handy web site.

Thanks
jackathan

:=Do many people use this forum?
:=
:=It seems like the same couple of dozen names regularly using it, with very little movement going on. Hardly anything has been posted for a week.
:=
:=Perhaps a revamp of the forum format may be in order to make it more inviting and fun to post. After all with as many members as we have at BSAC you'd think we could get some interest and stimulating conversation going.
:=
:=Thoughts please
:=
Sadly, if we all had more free time to post messages on BSAC's forums some might argue the opposite, but I do read with great interest what everyone is saying on the forum and my guess is that there are a great many in the same position but who don't have time to add their thoughts.

Truth is that some of us (probably a great many) are too busy organising or actually diving on the weekends to be that concerned about posting messages.

The last time I even had time to read the forum was six month ago - except for tonight after getting all the shops paper work done.

Paul at Freshwaterdiver,com

Nigel Hewitt

06-10-2005, 21:01

Do many people use this forum?

I've been wondering about this and I notice how predictable we all have become and I've come to the conclusion that only one person uses this forum: Keith Lawrence.

Basically we all lost interest years ago because we weren't allowed to get all upset and angsty and we all dropped out and forgot the BSAC forums ever existed. However Keith had a new forum upgrade planned and it was far too good to let it be lost due to mere dwindling traffic so one by one he adopted our personalities and kept up the pretence that there was debate and discussion running hoping that one day we would all flock back.

However now the strain is beginning to show and the multiple personalities are beginning to become more real and taking on a life of their own. You will notice that he uses his real address less and less which proves how bad it is becoming.

Now I admit it's scary to realise that you are only a temporary manifestation, a stereotype of views you once held. That as soon as he looks up from the computer you will be gone until he realises that 'you' would reply to a post but it's hard to be upset with the old boy. He tries hard. He needs a hobby. Maybe he should go diving...

Andy Wade

06-10-2005, 23:24

:=Do many people use this forum?

I've been wondering about this and I notice how predictable we all have become and I've come to the conclusion that only one person uses this forum: Keith Lawrence.

Basically we all lost interest years ago because we weren't allowed to get all upset and angsty and we all dropped out and forgot the BSAC forums ever existed. However Keith had a new forum upgrade planned and it was far too good to let it be lost due to mere dwindling traffic so one by one he adopted our personalities and kept up the pretence that there was debate and discussion running hoping that one day we would all flock back.

However now the strain is beginning to show and the multiple personalities are beginning to become more real and taking on a life of their own. You will notice that he uses his real address less and less which proves how bad it is becoming.

Now I admit it's scary to realise that you are only a temporary manifestation, a stereotype of views you once held. That as soon as he looks up from the computer you will be gone until he realises that 'you' would reply to a post but it's hard to be upset with the old boy. He tries hard. He needs a hobby. Maybe he should go diving...

Oh My God.

A conspiracy theory.

I feel like a new man.
Maybe I am.

.