Buddy- PADI OW & Ocean Diver?

[vidiotdave]

Hi,
I was wondering what the thoughts were on having a buddy on different training systems.

For example,

If I was a PADI Advanced Openwater can I buddy an Ocean Diver?
would it make a difference if it was just Openwater?

:)

[Frichie79]

Hi,

I think it depends on a lot of things other than the training agency. Off the top of my head it would be:

Relationship with the buddy, ie do you know each other or are u just partnering up for the first time, In which case you should just make sure you clear on signals and the dive plan.
What you both want to get from the dive, ie depth, bottom time, photographer v wreck diver etc

[vidiotdave]

thanks Frichie,
I understand those points, but it's more the legal side?
ie are you allowed?

for example 2 OD's can't dive together..? but 1 OD and 1 SD + can..

[Steve in Sharm]

Are you planning on diving on holiday or as part of a branch dive? That is the difference.

If your on holiday then its not a branch dive and you can dive with whoever you want, the PADI Divemaster will take the role of BSAC Divemanager and assess plans, situation, area etc and make sure you are both suitable.

If its a branch dive then all is good if the Dive Manager says so....

Regards

Steve

[Gareth]

Are you planning on diving on holiday or as part of a branch dive? That is the difference.

If your on holiday then its not a branch dive and you can dive with whoever you want, the PADI Divemaster will take the role of BSAC Divemanager and assess plans, situation, area etc and make sure you are both suitable.

If its a branch dive then all is good if the Dive Manager says so....

Regards

Steve

As Steve says above.

The other thing to remember is that a PADI AOW is basically a BSAC OD with a little bit more experience, not a SD.

There are a number of factors;
PADI & BSAC signals do differ slightly. In addition some instructors/branches/schools have their own signals. So you have two inexperienced divers with potentially differeing signals.
The OD has a shallower depth limitation than the PADI AOW.
The decompression tables are different, so you potentially have two different dive plans.
The ascent & descent rates are different, as are the 'over depth' 'over time' procedures.
If each diver is using 'standard' [1] kit configurations, these are different.
You have potentially two very inexperienced divers. Whilst this may not be the cae for a PADI AOW, with very few exceptions this will be the case for the vast majority of OD's. (Most branches actively push to get divers to SD as an absolute minimum.)

As Steve says with appropriate marshalling, in appropriate conditions it is often not an issue. However, both potentially lack the experience to make this judgement.

Gareth


[1] As much as their is a standard BSAC configuration.

[Ron MacRae]

Are you planning on diving on holiday or as part of a branch dive? That is the difference.

If your on holiday then its not a branch dive and you can dive with whoever you want, the PADI Divemaster will take the role of BSAC Divemanager and assess plans, situation, area etc and make sure you are both suitable.

If its a branch dive then all is good if the Dive Manager says so....

Regards

Steve

While what you say is basically true/correct it's not quite that simple in either case IMO. You can't just dump it all on the poor DM. The diver still has some responsabilities.

All BSAC divers should always dive in accordance with the BSAC "safe diving" document regardless of whether it's a club dive or not. Divers, even ODs, must know their limits on training, experience, depth, etc and have a duty of care to themselves and their buddies not to exceed these.

An OD should not dive to 30-40m just because the DM said it was ok. If it all went tits up at 40m both the DM and any surviving buddy would be in trouble. DMs can make mistakes, especially if the're trying to manage lots of unknown divers, and all divers should query a plan they're not comfortable with.

In our club 2 ODs will not dive together in open water. We pair them with experienced SDs or above and get them to SD themselves ASAP. I.e. no such thing as an experienced OD because by that time they are SD.

Ron.

[Edward]

for example 2 OD's can't dive together..? but 1 OD and 1 SD + can..

Hi Dave,

Actually that's not true, see here (http://www.bsac.com/page.asp?section=3303&sectionTitle=Ocean+Diver). I often allow 2 ODs or a mixture of OD equevalents to dive together.

However, the site is limited to a max depth of 20m and there is surface cover.

Regards

Edward

[ChristianG]

What you may be forgetting is that not all dive the BSAC, or PADI, or for that matter any other, way.

I know of many (to take just one example) PADI OW divers who would dive rings around many an Instructor (never mind the personal flavour of Instructor Agency of that particular Instructor).

It's called experience and there is no denying it. :rolleyes:

It happens that there is also another class of diver, the one that eschews the collection of C Cards in favour of going diving and learning with their peers "as they go". From a personal perspective I guess that is my preferred style of diver actually.

If you're newly trained, that's fine as well as a fine question to ask but never, as in never ever, look down your nose at any C Card that may be offered. Apart from anything else the hugely qualified, and experienced, Instructor holding that card might have chosen, for very good reasons that I can assimilate to, not to show other than their lowest qualification C Card. Alternatively, that might be the only one they hold but, well, as above.

As a very general observation, it's usually the ones that talk the loudest that know the least.

[TerryH]

it's usually the ones that talk the loudest that know the least.

To easy ;)

[ChristianG]

To easy ;)
I knew you wouldn't be able to resist. :)

[kdtan]

a padi aow may not know how to shoot a bag dependingon what electives they did. Not sure if an od would as I crossed over to sd. So much would depend on their experience rather than certification. In our club v unlikely we would allow two od to dive alone.