bsac vs padi

[barry wallace]

Hi all,

Sorry if this upsets anybody, but, why should I join a bsac club rather than a padi club and continue my diving tuition with them?
what are the differences/ benefits? and is my padi open water certificate recognized by you?
many Thanks
barry Wallace

[Keith Lawrence(BSAC)]

Hi all,

Sorry if this upsets anybody, but, why should I join a bsac club rather than a padi club and continue my diving tuition with them?
what are the differences/ benefits? and is my padi open water certificate recognized by you?
many Thanks
barry Wallace

Turn that around Barry ? why SHOULDN?T you join the BSAC? The answer to that one is that there is no reason at all why you shouldn?t! Being a BSAC member means that you are a member of a club, as such you get together with a group of like minded friends and do what you like doing ? going diving.

The main difference is that we are a group of friends helping each other out, there?s no commercial or time pressures, you?ll progress at your own pace and it will be your mates and the people who you dive with anyway who will be passing on their experience. There are commercial BSAC schools if you prefer the convenience of commercial training.

Diving wise there?s not a huge amount of difference, Boyles Law seems to apply to both PADI and BSAC divers in my experience :-) Because we?re UK based we tend to teach people to be more self reliant straight away (that only comes with the more advanced PADI courses) and things like rescue skills are taught in basic training.

Of course your PADI Open Water certificate will be recognised, you?re a diver and that?s all that matters. There?s a few bits and pieces that we do slightly different (such as our dive tables) but that?s easily sorted out. You are the same as one of our Ocean Divers, that?s what you will become in the BSAC scheme. Many clubs would then like to get you started straight away on our Sports Diver course, that will teach you some rescue skills, some more self reliance and go into more detail about things that you already know.

So, give us a try Barry. You?ll be joining a club, you?ll be amongst people with the same interests as you, there will be club diving trips organised, you?ll get the chance to progress your diver training. Have a look on <a href="http://www.bsac.org/branches/branchlist.htm" >http://www.bsac.org/branches/branchlist.htm</a> for BSAC branches near you, pay some of them a visit (as a guest, you don?t have to join straight away). All of our clubs are different, have a look around and find one that suits you!

Hope that helps

Keith L

[Edward Haynes]

Hi Barry

No, you question does not upset me.

First lets get the correct prospective for both organisations.

PADI is a commercial organisation set up to teach diving; some businesses do provide diving (at a cost) for those holding the required certification.

BSAC is a Club that goes diving; by default clubs also teach diving, but there primary existence is to "go diving".

Now for BSAC recognition of you Open Water certificate. If you joined a BSAC Branch you can dive within the limits of that certification or (and you have 2 choices here):

1. Continue your PADI training and continue to dive within these limits.

2. Cross-over your training and complete BSAC diver qualifications to Sport Diver, Dive Leader and beyond follow the link for full detailes).

So in essence, having got your Open Water certificate you can carry on paying a PADI business to take you diving - the local one to me is ?37.00 for 2 dives.

Or you can join a club and get involved in the whole diving experience not just the diving (Dive Planning, Marshalling and boat handling). As an comparison 2 dives with a club costs anything from ?10.00 to ?25.00. When you are diving with a Branch you will learn a lot from you fellow Branch members which PADI will charge you for (remember teaching diving skills is their livelihood).

HTH

Edward

[janos]

Hi all,

Sorry if this upsets anybody, but, why should I join a bsac club rather than a padi club and continue my diving tuition with them?
what are the differences/ benefits? and is my padi open water certificate recognized by you?

Hi Barry,

My club (London Hellfins, based near Waterloo, www.Hellfins.com) is more than happy to have qualified divers from whatever agency as new members. BSAC recognise your PADI qualification as equivalent to the Ocean Diver qualification, and you continue your training from that basis.

Personally I think the benefits of BSAC is the club environment. Clubs exist to help people go diving, and so you get a lot of diving trips organised at cost price. Also you get regular access to a pool, cheap equipment hire, cheap courses (I'm organising a Nitrox course at the moment which costs very little money) and also the chance to talk and dive with some very experienced divers for free.

Plus there is a great social life.

Downside is that it can take longer to qualify then PADI, but if you're not in a rush then that's not a problem.

Probably the best thing to do is talk to a few of your local branches and see if you can find one that you like and is right for you. (Branches do vary in their outlook and the diving they do). Ask them how long it takes to get trained, and a bit more about the specifics of any courses that you're interested in. You don't have to do further training if you don't want to, but I'd recommend it

Whereabouts are you based? Someone here might be a member of a branch close to you.

Janos

[Tony Dwyer]

Hi all,

Sorry if this upsets anybody, but, why should I join a bsac club rather than a padi club and continue my diving tuition with them?
what are the differences/ benefits? and is my padi open water certificate recognized by you?
many Thanks
barry Wallace

Diving is diving, regardless of which organisation one was trained by.

Yes, your PADI Open Water certification is recognised by BSAC. Have a look at:

<a href="http://www.bsac.org/techserv/salt3.htm" >http://www.bsac.org/techserv/salt3.htm</a>

BSAC = British Sub-Aqua Club. It's just that, a real club, that every member has a voice in.
PADI = Professional Association of Diving Instructors - A business. American. Diver training is carried out commercially by PADI certified instructors, usually working for a dive centre.

There are some genuine democratic clubs that were formed by PADI certified divers, but most are associated either directly or indirectly) with commercial dive centres. They primarily exist as a means of maintaining a customer base for the dive centre. PADI encourage this as a marketing ploy.
I believe that some are actually run as an offshoot business to the dive centre. Such organisations are not clubs. Ongoing training on offer will almost certainly be charged for, for profit margin.

BSAC branches however are REAL clubs. Run by the members for the benefit of the members. Any excess of income over expenditure stays with the branch, for the benefit of the members.
Most training is generally provided free of charge by qualified instructors within each branch, though one can attend external courses for specific skill development.
There will be some costs and these vary from club to club, depending on what facilities they have.
If you join a branch,. you will become a BSAC member and a member of the branch - club fees vary, but the BSAC component is constant.
Some branches (like mine) make SCUBA kit available to new members, for base level training. For us, there is a small charge to cover maintenance costs. Nowhere near as much as it would be to hire the same kit from a dive centre.
Some branches charge for pool use on each attendance, for others it's embedded in the annual subscription. Members of my branch may use our pool 49 Fridays each year. The pool is closed on bank holidays.
The club environment fosters regular practice of skills and diving with people you get to know well. It's pretty easy to make really firm friends in the club environment.

Many BSAC branches have lots of members with dual or multiple qualifications with PADI, TDI etc. Diving is diving.

The PADI training programme is good, as is the BSAC one. However the quality of the training is only as good as the instructor delivering it. There are good and not so good in each organisation. Many branches (like mine) have excellent instructors and do lots of diving, both in the UK and abroard. So take the time to look around and chat.

So benefits of a BSAC branch:

The BSAC Diver Training Programme (British! waves flag!)
You have a say in how the branch is run via the democratic process, usually at the Annual General Meeting (AGM). You may even stand for office if the urge takes you.
Ongoing training at low cost.
Great way to meet people.
Most branches have an active programme of diving each year.
Easy access to buddies to go diving with.

have a look at:

<a href="http://www.bsac.com/about/whychoose.htm" >http://www.bsac.com/about/whychoose.htm</a>

regards

Tony

[Alan Ewart]

Hi all,

Sorry if this upsets anybody, but, why should I join a bsac club rather than a padi club and continue my diving tuition with them?
what are the differences/ benefits? and is my padi open water certificate recognized by you?
many Thanks
barry Wallace

Hi Barry,
I went through a similar experience a while back. I was a member of a PADI club which offerred some really great training at a cost. Want to dive a wreck....Do a wreck diving course a mere ?150.

Second dive of the day is a drift dive... I see you haven't done the drift diving course...That'll be ?150 please. You get the picture??

I joined BSAC, looked around spoke to a few local branches, joined one I liked the feel of & never looked back :-). BSAC branches will generally give you loads of training at little or no cost. You get to dive with loads of experienced buddies. I found the crossover into further training painless and fun.

Just a couple of things to bear in mind. People are giving their time free so be patient, BSAC courses through a branch don't normally run 'on demand' (though you can buy a course through a BSAC School.

When joining a branch check it does the kind of diving you want to do.

Come on in the waters lovely :-)

Alan

[Bren Tierney]

Hi all,

Sorry if this upsets anybody, but, why should I join a bsac club rather than a padi club and continue my diving tuition with them?
what are the differences/ benefits? and is my padi open water certificate recognized by you?
many Thanks
barry Wallace


Hi Barry,

I came up the PADI route - it suited me at the time (1990) - and then switched to TDI, as that suited me at the time.

That said, and I'm not a BSAC-trained diver or member, but I've never dived with a poorly trained or 'dangerous' (to themselves or their buddy) BSAC trained diver, and I've met and buddied alot of divers over the years.

They will ensure that are allowed to acquire the requisite diver and diving safety skills and end-up a rounded and 'good-to-go' diver. They put alot into their basic/initial diver course which would be a second or third chargeable course under other training agencies - they teach a large amount of diver rescue and in-water safety aspects on their intro course.

Also BSAC run a 'club' system which means that you can dive with both those your trained with and others more experienced than you at times to suit you - this is a confidence-building aspect which commercial agencies largely ignore as they invariably only want to see you when you are spending money on a course with them. Indeed, it could be argued that commercial 'clubs', per se, don't exist.

Good luck mate. They, BSAC, didn't last this long by getting it wrong! ;-)

What ever you choose, dive safe.

Bren.

[Bren Tierney]

:=Hi all,
:=
:=Sorry if this upsets anybody, but, why should I join a bsac club rather than a padi club and continue my diving tuition with them?
:=what are the differences/ benefits? and is my padi open water certificate recognized by you?
:=many Thanks
:=barry Wallace

Turn that around Barry ? why SHOULDN?T you join the BSAC? The answer to that one is that there is no reason at all why you shouldn?t! Being a BSAC member means that you are a member of a club, as such you get together with a group of like minded friends and do what you like doing ? going diving.

The main difference is that we are a group of friends helping each other out, there?s no commercial or time pressures, you?ll progress at your own pace and it will be your mates and the people who you dive with anyway who will be passing on their experience. There are commercial BSAC schools if you prefer the convenience of commercial training.

Diving wise there?s not a huge amount of difference, Boyles Law seems to apply to both PADI and BSAC divers in my experience :-) Because we?re UK based we tend to teach people to be more self reliant straight away (that only comes with the more advanced PADI courses) and things like rescue skills are taught in basic training.

Of course your PADI Open Water certificate will be recognised, you?re a diver and that?s all that matters. There?s a few bits and pieces that we do slightly different (such as our dive tables) but that?s easily sorted out. You are the same as one of our Ocean Divers, that?s what you will become in the BSAC scheme. Many clubs would then like to get you started straight away on our Sports Diver course, that will teach you some rescue skills, some more self reliance and go into more detail about things that you already know.

So, give us a try Barry. You?ll be joining a club, you?ll be amongst people with the same interests as you, there will be club diving trips organised, you?ll get the chance to progress your diver training. Have a look on <a href="http://www.bsac.org/branches/branchlist.htm" >http://www.bsac.org/branches/branchlist.htm</a> for BSAC branches near you, pay some of them a visit (as a guest, you don?t have to join straight away). All of our clubs are different, have a look around and find one that suits you!

Hope that helps

Keith L

Keith mate,

I really thought you'd have an FAQ covering the 'for and against' for this old chestnut by now!? ;-)

Cheers,

Bren.

[barry wallace]

:=Hi all,
:=
:=Sorry if this upsets anybody, but, why should I join a bsac club rather than a padi club and continue my diving tuition with them?
:=what are the differences/ benefits? and is my padi open water certificate recognized by you?

Hi Barry,

My club (London Hellfins, based near Waterloo, www.Hellfins.com) is more than happy to have qualified divers from whatever agency as new members. BSAC recognise your PADI qualification as equivalent to the Ocean Diver qualification, and you continue your training from that basis.

Personally I think the benefits of BSAC is the club environment. Clubs exist to help people go diving, and so you get a lot of diving trips organised at cost price. Also you get regular access to a pool, cheap equipment hire, cheap courses (I'm organising a Nitrox course at the moment which costs very little money) and also the chance to talk and dive with some very experienced divers for free.

Plus there is a great social life.

Downside is that it can take longer to qualify then PADI, but if you're not in a rush then that's not a problem.

Probably the best thing to do is talk to a few of your local branches and see if you can find one that you like and is right for you. (Branches do vary in their outlook and the diving they do). Ask them how long it takes to get trained, and a bit more about the specifics of any courses that you're interested in. You don't have to do further training if you don't want to, but I'd recommend it

Whereabouts are you based? Someone here might be a member of a branch close to you.

Janos

Thanks for your reply Janos, sound advice, I live on the outskirts of Notts, there is a club in my village ( Bingham)which is why I am thinking of joining.

regards

[Helen Butcher]

:=Sorry if this upsets anybody, but, why should I join a bsac club rather than a padi club and continue my diving tuition with them?

Doesn't bother me one way or the other - i'm more impressed by a diver who goes diving, and what their diving skills are, than what agency they trained with.

That said, and I'm not a BSAC-trained diver or member, but I've never dived with a poorly trained or 'dangerous' (to themselves or their buddy) BSAC trained diver, and I've met and buddied alot of divers over the years.

The main reason i picked BSAC to train with was their excellent reputation for turning out divers with solid rescue and buoyancy skills who are popular to dive with, all over the world.

They will ensure that are allowed to acquire the requisite diver and diving safety skills and end-up a rounded and 'good-to-go' diver. They put alot into their basic/initial diver course which would be a second or third chargeable course under other training agencies - they teach a large amount of diver rescue and in-water safety aspects on their intro course.

The structure of BSAC training means that unless you do it through a school it takes a lot longer to complete, because it involves a lot more diving whilst training. However, i feel this is one of its strengths, as the extra experience you get during training means that you are a lot more skilled than you would be were this completed quicker.

Also BSAC run a 'club' system which means that you can dive with both those your trained with and others more experienced than you at times to suit you

My club are great - they give me a lot of my social life, i have some great friends within the club, and they have fitted my dive training in round my rota at times to suit me. Means you can go diving using the club structure either to find a buddy or to use a boat, without having to pay a commercial business, you also pick up loads of stuff just from watching the other experienced divers in the club.

Get the right club is the best advice you will get - if it doesn't feel right and/or you get any anti-PADI comments then just move on till you find one thats right for you - there are as many different BSAC clubs as there are different sorts of divers! Some clubs do lots of diving but no training, so if you want to train further make sure you pick one with active training instructors.

Good luck - and welcome if you decide to plunge in!

Helen

[jim oldham]

Sorry if this upsets anybody, but, why should I join a bsac club rather than a padi club and continue my diving tuition with them?
what are the differences/ benefits? and is my padi open water certificate recognized by you?

Many people have commented on the quality of training and I will second that. My club, Chorley 304, (plug), is very good and , as someone mentioned, it is done at my pace. I am 50+ and wanted to go nice and easy and build up confidence. Others chose a faster route. The club allows for this.
We recently had a 5 day trip to Lochaline using the club RHIB. ?150, self catering, with 5 dives (booze not included). We could have done more, but people were happy with that. I had the benefit of diving with people with years of diving experience and up to the level of Advanced Diver and Avance Diver Instructor. That is very good value for money in anyone's book, as my mates are doing this because thay want to; not because they have to to earn a living. That is not a dig at PADI, but a staement of fact.
Regards,
Jim
PS. It was also a crackingly hilarious trip.

[TerryH]

Hi all,

Sorry if this upsets anybody, but, why should I join a bsac club rather than a padi club and continue my diving tuition with them?
what are the differences/ benefits? and is my padi open water certificate recognized by you?
many Thanks
barry Wallace

Hi Barry, nice to see you are researching all the options.
Can I just squash one common misconception which has been
mentioned on here and other sites.

BSAC does not take longer than PADI and PADI isnt quicker.

Roughly speaking .......
A PADI school takes 4 days/32 hours.
A BSAC school takes 4 days/32 hours.

A PADI club takes 2 days + 6 nights/32 hours.
A BSAC club takes 2 days + 6 nights/32 hours.

The problem is that the vast majority of schools are PADI, so
if you do a PADI course it will be done over 4 days and would
give the impression that PADI were quick.

The vast majority of clubs are BSAC, so that gives the
impression that at 6 nights (once a week) and 2 days open water
it can take 2 months!!!!!!!!!!!

So old wives tale PADI is fast, BSAC slow.
Reality - Schools fast, clubs slow (in comparison).
Agency is irrelevant.

TerryH

[iain aitchison]

Hi all,

Sorry if this upsets anybody, but, why should I join a bsac club rather than a padi club and continue my diving tuition with them?
what are the differences/ benefits? and is my padi open water certificate recognized by you?
many Thanks
barry Wallace

Hi Barry,

Looking from the distance there are a few thoughts which I would like to share with you. I think BSAC and PADI are teaching the same sport at the introductory sport diving level but have different aims further up in the system. Either system, applied as it was intended, has the potential to teach excellent divers and inspiring instructors. Great divers and great instructors share the same abilities and motivations regardless of the system and many of them are registered or are active within more than one system at once. Important is the true quality of the diving, the inspiration of the teaching and being able to fulfil your ambitions for yourself in the sport. Clubs are about friendship and fun of working and playing together with like minded friends and making our sport happen for us all to enjoy. If you are interested in more technical diving, leading dives and diving expeditions, and in doing this in the more severe conditions rather than holiday diving and particularly if you are interested in more demanding projects using diving then BSAC will be a stronger support to you. The BSAC instructor training is second to none, much envied and much to be recommended. Perhaps at the beginning at least, think of BSAC as a parallel path to PADI. If you choose BSAC you will not be dissapointed and in a club situation at least BSAC will offer you more possiblities in the longer term.
Try us.

regards
Iain Aitchison
BSAC First Class Diver and BSAC Advanced Instructor

[Chris Cherrington]

Hi all,

Sorry if this upsets anybody, but, why should I join a bsac club rather than a padi club and continue my diving tuition with them?
what are the differences/ benefits? and is my padi open water certificate recognized by you?
many Thanks
barry Wallace

If you want to join a club BSAC are great - PADI clubs not so great. Some exceptions to this "rule" as you might imagine. If you want to stay independent then you will be better off with school (PADI) training.

PADI "clubs" are set up by the shop and geared to provide contacts, buddies and holiday offers etc. no training is offered.

PADI OW = BSAC OD.

Chris