View Full Version : To invert or not to invert?
What are people's opinions on inverting twin sets, or even single cylinders, although I don't see the point unless you have a pony.
Any opinions on their use is appreciated, whether you dive inverted (hopefully not actually inverted yourself) or not.:)
What are people's opinions on inverting twin sets, or even single cylinders, although I don't see the point unless you have a pony.
Any opinions on their use is appreciated, whether you dive inverted (hopefully not actually inverted yourself) or not.:)
Makes it easier to reach the valves if you need to shut down for any reason. Or to turn them on if you forgot before jumping in and don't want to look a pratt :eek:
Nigel Hewitt
11-01-2010, 17:51
What are people's opinions on inverting twin sets, or even single cylinders, although I don't see the point unless you have a pony.
Any opinions on their use is appreciated, whether you dive inverted (hopefully not actually inverted yourself) or not.:)
You are going to have to learn to use the forum search before you annoy too many people asking questions on well discussed subjects.
Oh yes - sorry Nigel, didn't think of that.
You are going to have to learn to use the forum search before you annoy too many people asking questions on well discussed subjects.
Nigel,
You could have just provided him with the link :D
http://www.nigelhewitt.co.uk/diving/rig.html
regards
Hamish
from your existing staements in several threads your only just starting to tip toe into diving, yet your asking some quite indepth questions about fundamentaly chainging the setup of your kit.
why are you looking at doing this? is it a drive to presetup for technical courses which i would guess its going to be several years bofore you get the experiance and traiing to use fully. is it a drive to be at the very edge of diving to push yourself?
or do you simply think that aiming to be going deeper makes you better?
on a personal note i look at depth as something which is avalible but not essential to a good dive. ive had fantastic dives at 7m and crap ones at 30 ish
Steve Walsh
11-01-2010, 20:01
from your existing staements in several threads your only just starting to tip toe into diving, yet your asking some quite indepth questions about fundamentaly chainging the setup of your kit.
why are you looking at doing this? is it a drive to presetup for technical courses which i would guess its going to be several years bofore you get the experiance and traiing to use fully. is it a drive to be at the very edge of diving to push yourself?
or do you simply think that aiming to be going deeper makes you better?
on a personal note i look at depth as something which is avalible but not essential to a good dive. ive had fantastic dives at 7m and crap ones at 30 ish
we all have :)
as for the OP its what works for you.
I had difficulties with reaching shoulders etc because of injuries sustained playing rugby so inverting was a no brainer for me.
plus everybody can scratch their arris but not all can scratch back :)
and as paul say you seem to be going indepth very very quickly. hving read some posts they seem to be " baiting posts" is there a hidden agenda ? I hope not
This is getting quite annoying now.:( I have explained several times that many of the questions that I am asking are purely out of interest. Just because I have, or want to have, knowledge, it doesn't mean that i want to use it!
I have no plans to use a twinset right now, but I just wondered what people think about how they should be set up.
And thanks Nigel, I had already read your article on your website - I would like to see what other people have to say.
Also, when are those carbon fiber cylinders going to be available to the rest of us?
Nigel Hewitt
11-01-2010, 21:22
Also, when are those carbon fiber cylinders going to be available to the rest of us?They're available.
They just happen to be several times the price of steel and you need to speak a little German.
A wise man once told me to do twenty or thirty dives in a piece of kit before thinking about changing it. I think that's sound advice, and something I try and follow.
Janos
They're available.
They just happen to be several times the price of steel and you need to speak a little German.And buy an extra long weightbelt for all the lead.
I have proper dodgy shoulders (both partially dislocated) and can shut down easily. It's about the right suit, undersuit and harness and being flat or even slightly head down in the water.
Ooooooo and practice.
Alot of people have trouble reaching the isolator when they're inverted.
Maria CM
12-01-2010, 10:20
I have no plans to use a twinset right now, but I just wondered what people think about how they should be set up.
Blimey James - how much money have you got access too????:D
There is a lot to be said for researching before you start buying too much kit. There is the stuff that you buy to get you in the water, and the stuff that you buy to develop your diving. If you do some research on where you think you may go in the future with your diving you can then buy stuff that will 'grow' with you.
e.g. I bought 2 x 15s and a pony. I now think I may have been better to buy 12s and a pony so that they could be superglued:D together later when I could afford the extra bits to make them into a twinset....
Don't have such a stable resting point if inverted and more likely to damage I would have thought, but possibly easier to reach.
best wishes,
Maria
Ron MacRae
12-01-2010, 11:56
Also, when are those carbon fiber cylinders going to be available to the rest of us?
Why would you want carbon fiber cylinders? It just means more lead on the belt.
The main reason I chose steel twin 12 300s over twin 12 232s was so I wouldn't need a weight belt at all. When I bend over to tighten the weight belt is when I really start to feel ill. With the 300s I sit down, slip on the twinset, stand up, fall in water. Much more civilised.:)
I can't think of a positive for having Carbon Fibre cylinders.:confused:
Perhaps someone can enlighten me?
Ron.
Ed Howarth
12-01-2010, 12:05
I can't think of a positive for having Carbon Fibre cylinders.:confused:
Perhaps someone can enlighten me?
Ron.
Humour!
A mate of mine borrowed one from a firman for a laugh. He asked me to lift it from the boot of his car and I nearly put my back out when it almost flew up in the air.
Ed
micromouse
12-01-2010, 13:15
I can't think of a positive for having Carbon Fibre cylinders.:confused:
Perhaps someone can enlighten me?
Ron.
Are they black and sexy looking? I though anything made of CF was supposed to be the 'In thing'.
MM
A wise man once told me to do twenty or thirty dives in a piece of kit before thinking about changing it. I think that's sound advice, and something I try and follow.
My old branch had a trainee once that was always struggling with his trim and buoyancy. After I took him for a dive he was telling me how annoying it was for him to be all over the place compared to the instructor he was with on any particular dive and that he was thinking about changing XYZ piece of kit to try and solve the problem. I asked him how long he had been diving with particular setup, "2 or 3 dives", and the setup before that "2 or 3 dives" and the one before that "2 or 3 dives". He did after discussion get the point and did keep his kit the same for most of the rest of his (short) diving career. Can not really complain though as the other trainees at the time got access to lots of virtually new decent quality kit
Are they black and sexy looking? I though anything made of CF was supposed to be the 'In thing'.
MMOnly if you are chav in a Nova.
Nigel Hewitt
12-01-2010, 14:39
Are they black and sexy looking? I though anything made of CF was supposed to be the 'In thing'.
Mine are white and actually rather tatty looking.
But at 10.9Kg I can pick up two of them and carry them back to the car.
At my age I can't go that on a pair of 12/300s in steel.
I dive them with a 2Kg weightbelt on each so the are neutral empty. If I have to use them (they are CCR bailouts) I can clip them to the line and slip the belt if they get to be a problem and they'll be waiting for me at the surface.
link to pic (http://www.nigelhewitt.co.uk/diving/12l300bcf.jpg).
These are sexy and black in parts and smooth but only two litres (http://www.nigelhewitt.co.uk/stuff/2L300Bw.jpg).
Steve Walsh
13-01-2010, 20:24
just to clarify the shutdown on " right way up cylinders" I can do it but it hurts like *$£" so i choose to do it the way it doesn't hurt.
This is very tongue-in-cheek, but have you looked at this site yet.
http://www.gosidemount.com/
On a serious note after watching the videos i really could see some use in learning to use a rig like that. It seems less wrap around and constrictive. Maybe a path for you to look at if you considered doing the independent twin setup. Also appears to be a very minimalist approach to diving. I dont do caves and would be using it for standard sea and pond dives, but still it really appeals to me. Sorry this is kind of OT.
ianfirmin
14-01-2010, 15:07
These are sexy and black in parts and smooth but only two litres (http://www.nigelhewitt.co.uk/stuff/2L300Bw.jpg).
Be careful with these. They look suspiciously like BA cylinders (I use one myself). If they ARE BA cylinders they are not really designed for underwater use. The integrated presure gauge will let water in, corrode and eventually fail. The valves can also rust.
I've fitted mine with an underwater valve (without integrated gauge) and, despite dire warnings that it would fall apart under water, it's done me well now for a couple of years.
ATB
Ian
Nigel Hewitt
14-01-2010, 15:16
I've fitted mine with an underwater valve (without integrated gauge) and, despite dire warnings that it would fall apart under water, it's done me well now for a couple of years.
Sorry. Old picture. They now have AP shaped 'knob coming sideways' valves on (which cost a bomb because it's a smaller neck than normal).
Good point though...
Dave Whitlow
14-01-2010, 19:04
This is very tongue-in-cheek, but have you looked at this site yet.
http://www.gosidemount.com/
On a serious note after watching the videos i really could see some use in learning to use a rig like that. It seems less wrap around and constrictive. Maybe a path for you to look at if you considered doing the independent twin setup. Also appears to be a very minimalist approach to diving. I dont do caves and would be using it for standard sea and pond dives, but still it really appeals to me.
Watching the videos I felt my buoyancy control could improve further ... and it isn't hog loop so could be used for instructing?
Maria CM
14-01-2010, 20:06
http://www.gosidemount.com/
Wow... impressed!
best wishes,
Maria
ianfirmin
14-01-2010, 20:13
This is very tongue-in-cheek, but have you looked at this site yet.
http://www.gosidemount.com/
On a serious note after watching the videos i really could see some use in learning to use a rig like that. It seems less wrap around and constrictive. Maybe a path for you to look at if you considered doing the independent twin setup. Also appears to be a very minimalist approach to diving. I dont do caves and would be using it for standard sea and pond dives, but still it really appeals to me. Sorry this is kind of OT.
I must admit to trying something very similar. Just a 10 litre stage clipped to a harness. No bcd.
For shallow stuff where you don't need to compensate very much for the weight of gas (as you are not using a load of gas) just a DS is fine.
Great fun!
A few years ago a mate of mine ordered a new side mount harness from Dragon, who specialise in Caving Equipment. I think they are based in Wales. Anyway, it was delivered to his next door neighbour by mistake who opened it. She knocked on his door the next day with a huge grin on her chops, and said "oh I didn't know you were into this. Do you want to come over one night".
northern_diver
14-01-2010, 23:34
A few years ago a mate of mine ordered a new side mount harness from Dragon, who specialise in Caving Equipment. I think they are based in Wales. Anyway, it was delivered to his next door neighbour by mistake who opened it. She knocked on his door the next day with a huge grin on her chops, and said "oh I didn't know you were into this. Do you want to come over one night".
ROTFLMAO:D
Cool.
John
Steve Walsh
15-01-2010, 17:42
A few years ago a mate of mine ordered a new side mount harness from Dragon, who specialise in Caving Equipment. I think they are based in Wales. Anyway, it was delivered to his next door neighbour by mistake who opened it. She knocked on his door the next day with a huge grin on her chops, and said "oh I didn't know you were into this. Do you want to come over one night".
drying my backplate, drysuit and hood outside on the line brought some horrified looks from the devout christians who lived next door to me.
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