View Full Version : Basic and Snorkel Diver - Membership Needed?
Dave Woodward
18-12-2009, 17:53
I am hoping to run a Basic, and Snorkel diver course for kids at the members club to which my Dive Club is atttached, and I wanted to clarify whether or not they would need to be BSAC members?
It was suggested that they woudl be, but I have the snorkelling instructors resource disc and it says that for the Basic and the Snorkel Diver it can be delivered to non-members.
Anyone know?
Dave
I am hoping to run a Basic, and Snorkel diver course for kids at the members club to which my Dive Club is atttached, and I wanted to clarify whether or not they would need to be BSAC members?
It was suggested that they woudl be, but I have the snorkelling instructors resource disc and it says that for the Basic and the Snorkel Diver it can be delivered to non-members.
Anyone know?
Dave
Hi Dave,
If memory serves the requirement is for all Snorkel instructors to be BSAC members, but if being run by a Snorkel Centre (companies, organisations or local authorities) then those receiving don't, but pay the non-members cost for the course and materials.
Contact Mike Clack (Commercial Co-ordinator) on 0151 350 6206 or mikec@bsac.com for clarification.
Regards
Edward
I think the question was about whether the students need to be BSAC members (sorry if I've misread).
When I did basic and snorkel diver, I don't think I was a member - but that was several years ago so a) I may not remember correctly b) things may have changed :eek:
Definitely worth a call to HQ, they'll tell you for definite.
G
Hi Dave,
If memory serves the requirement is for all Snorkel instructors to be BSAC members, but if being run by a Snorkel Centre (companies, organisations or local authorities) then those receiving don't, but pay the non-members cost for the course and materials.
Contact Mike Clack (Commercial Co-ordinator) on 0151 350 6206 or mikec@bsac.com for clarification.
Regards
Edward
rick stevens
23-12-2009, 12:34
I believe that you do not need to be a BSAC member for the Basic course, but you do need to be for the Snorkel Diver course.
It was explained to me as being an insurance issue. If you teach non members for more than a certain number of hours, then you are classed as doing it commercially, and hence the clubs insurance is invalid. The figure of 5 hours rings a bell with me, but I could be wrong.
ChristianG
23-12-2009, 12:59
I believe that you do not need to be a BSAC member for the Basic course, but you do need to be for the Snorkel Diver course.
It was explained to me as being an insurance issue. If you teach non members for more than a certain number of hours, then you are classed as doing it commercially, and hence the clubs insurance is invalid. The figure of 5 hours rings a bell with me, but I could be wrong.
Blimey! :eek:
When I first "learned" to snorkel I simply did so by myself, as a pre teen IIRC. I was very proud of my full face mask with two snorkels with Ping Pong balls sticking out of the forehead part of the skirt. I do remember that it was called a "Medusa" but I have no idea who made it although it was probably Italian.
Last time I looked, admittedly a long time ago, I'm still alive.
Hi Dave,
If memory serves the requirement is for all Snorkel instructors to be BSAC members, but if being run by a Snorkel Centre (companies, organisations or local authorities) then those receiving don't, but pay the non-members cost for the course and materials.
Contact Mike Clack (Commercial Co-ordinator) on 0151 350 6206 or mikec@bsac.com for clarification.
Regards
Edward
I got it wrong, see here (http://www.bsac.com/page.asp?section=2480§ionTitle=Snorkel+membership+requirements) and here (http://www.bsac.com/page.asp?section=1936§ionTitle=Branch+Officers%27+Handbook+-+Diver+Qualifications[/url) reproduced if you can't access the members' area:
Basic Snorkel Diver – This is an introductory course, available to anyone who is confident in the water and capable of swimming. It will train them in the use of basic snorkelling equipment of mask, fins and snorkel in a pool environment. No age limit is imposed but younger students should be confident in the water. Membership of the BSAC is mandatory to embark on this training course.
Regards
Edward
garethwoodruff
23-12-2009, 14:29
Blimey! :eek:
When I first "learned" to snorkel I simply did so by myself, as a pre teen IIRC. I was very proud of my full face mask with two snorkels with Ping Pong balls sticking out of the forehead part of the skirt. I do remember that it was called a "Medusa" but I have no idea who made it although it was probably Italian.
Last time I looked, admittedly a long time ago, I'm still alive.
Thats cool, did you 'self learn' everything thats covered by the snorkling courses? Displacement clearing, snorkel buddy skills etc....:)
Were pre-teens not called childern in those days ? :eek:
Cheers,
Gareth.
ChristianG
23-12-2009, 15:01
Thats cool, did you 'self learn' everything thats covered by the snorkling courses? Displacement clearing, snorkel buddy skills etc....:)
Were pre-teens not called childern in those days ? :eek:
They were probably called children - sorry - in those days. :rolleyes:
In fact yes, they did cover pretty well everything, or rather we learned it all "as we went", apart from "buddy skills" of course, there was no such concept then. Fact of the matter is that we all became good to excellent spearos, something that I am not proud of nowadays but at least we were selective in what we gathered even then. In those days IIRC I could easily cruise at 20 metres when, today, I probably couldn't duck dive to 10, or even five, metres.
What I tried to say is that there are some things that really shouldn't need learning, as in formal learning, and snorkelling is one. I say this when one of my best friends (a term I don't use lightly) is a BSAC snorkelling instructor in Scotland if only because she's visited the pot too many times and this is all that is left to her. No, none of her (three) bends were properly explainable.
[QUOTE=ChristianG]
What I tried to say is that there are some things that really shouldn't need learning, as in formal learning, and snorkelling is one.QUOTE]
G'Day, Christian. :)
Like you, I was 'self-taught' when it came to snorkelling. And like you, I managed to survive the 'ping-pong ball'. However, snorkelling is not without its dangers. You may recall that only a few months ago an apparently experienced spear-fisherman died off Long Reef (on Sydney's Northern Beaches) as a result of hyper-ventilation: a condition that he and his companions seemingly knew little about and had - in all of their previous excursions - managed to avoid. (Something that might possibly have been avoided had they sought some sort of 'formal' instruction?)
Regards
Strike
Phil Laughton
23-12-2009, 23:01
Blimey! :eek:
When I first "learned" to snorkel I simply did so by myself, as a pre teen IIRC. I was very proud of my full face mask with two snorkels with Ping Pong balls sticking out of the forehead part of the skirt. I do remember that it was called a "Medusa" but I have no idea who made it although it was probably Italian.
Last time I looked, admittedly a long time ago, I'm still alive.
Like you I learned to snorkel a life time ago. My mask was a Typhoon half mask with a perspex window, my snorkel was a Typhoon "S" shaped tube also with a ping-pong ball valve. However, the thick woolen jumper recommended for open water snorkeling wasn't up to sea temperatures off the Isle of Man.
When I joined the BSAC I had to complete groups A, B, C swimming and snorkeling before I was let any where near the one small aqualung the branch owned for training.
How things have changed!
Phil
Founder member, Doncaster 75 branch
ChristianG
24-12-2009, 10:02
Like you, I was 'self-taught' when it came to snorkelling. And like you, I managed to survive the 'ping-pong ball'. However, snorkelling is not without its dangers. You may recall that only a few months ago an apparently experienced spear-fisherman died off Long Reef (on Sydney's Northern Beaches) as a result of hyper-ventilation: a condition that he and his companions seemingly knew little about and had - in all of their previous excursions - managed to avoid. (Something that might possibly have been avoided had they sought some sort of 'formal' instruction?)
IIRC I first learned of the dangers of hyperventilation in the late fifties - there was probably little known about it at that time other than that if seemed to allow for blackouts, therefore a distinct ability to die whereas today we know exactly, or close to, why this should be so.
I had (didn't everyone?) hyperventilated to my heart's content before that but promptly dropped the idea like a hot coal as soon as I learned that.
Quite frankly, and this may sound blase or cold hearted to some, but in this day and age with all that collective knowledge out there how should it be possible for an experienced spearo to continue to practice something which has been discredited for well over half a century? I mean, if he already knew how to hyperventilate why didn't he also know the cons of it?
Oh, by teaching it? Just like in SCUBA? Any one can pick up a tank, mask etc and go diving however I doubt that it happens very often, if at all. I'm reminded, many years ago on our south coast of the new diver doing a shore dive with his snorkelling "buddy". The snorkeller swam down to the diver who offered his first stage, so the snorkeller took a breath - and had a fatal barotrauma on the way up.
I wonder how many divers don't actually know that you never, ever, offer air to a snorkeller? I wonder how many snorkellers don't actually know that you never, ever, accept air from a diver?
Quite frankly, and this may sound blase or cold hearted to some, but in this day and age with all that collective knowledge out there how should it be possible for an experienced spearo to continue to practice something which has been discredited for well over half a century?
Many people revel in their ignorance. They simply cannot see past the fact that something hasn't interested them, and take that to mean that it is therefore unimportant.
For reasons I cannot explain, there types often seem to want to impart their "wisdom" as often as possible - replete with factual errors, inaccuracies, old wives' tales, ...
Vic.
Many people revel in their ignorance. They simply cannot see past the fact that something hasn't interested them, and take that to mean that it is therefore unimportant.
For reasons I cannot explain, there types often seem to want to impart their "wisdom" as often as possible - replete with factual errors, inaccuracies, old wives' tales, ...
Thinking about anyone in particular??? :D
Nigel Hewitt
24-12-2009, 11:41
Thinking about anyone in particular??? :D
Sounds like me...
My life is full of the horror of the impressive list of things I don't understand.
I read and I explore but, frankly, the list is growing faster than I can catch things up.
Diving isn't too bad.
I can understand most of that.
However I'm not confident of getting an explanation of Inertia in my life time.
"It just is" doesn't really cut it for me...
Sorry. Thread drift.
Thinking about anyone in particular???
Not from here.
I've been doing some Groklaw stuff for an article I'm putting together.
Most of the FUD in that story is deliberate - there are large commercial concerns with a lot of cash to lose if they don't get their own way in the courts. But there's a significant vein of nonsense from people who just like to hold forth, without atually knowing what they're talking about :-(
Vic.
My life is full of the horror of the impressive list of things I don't understand.
I read and I explore but, frankly, the list is growing faster than I can catch things up.
That's true for most of us...
Ignorance is not to be feared - there's some of it in all of us. It's the simultaneous profession of expertise that annoys me.
Vic.
Blimey! :eek:
When I first "learned" to snorkel I simply did so by myself, as a pre teen IIRC. I was very proud of my full face mask with two snorkels with Ping Pong balls sticking out of the forehead part of the skirt. I do remember that it was called a "Medusa" but I have no idea who made it although it was probably Italian.
Last time I looked, admittedly a long time ago, I'm still alive.
I too learned to snorkel in a public swimming pool in the late 1950s and early 1960s, when public swimming pools permitted the use of fins, masks and snorkels. I'm grateful that pool managers back then realised how better it was for youngsters to learn to snorkel in a safe place before venturing to open water. In today's public pools with their roped-off lanes, young people wanting to learn snorkelling in this informal way no longer have this option, thanks to health and safety jobsworths.
On the subject of the Medusa snorkel mask, it was made by Cressi. See the Historical Diving Society of Italy file at
http://www.hdsitalia.com/articoli/20_attrezzature.pdf
where you can see a monochrome image of it. Many different models of snorkel mask existed in the 1950s and some are illustrated alongside the Medusa in the same file. Snorkel masks haven't completely disappeared. There's at least one still in production, if Majorca Sub's web page at
http://www.majorcasub.gr/products/03-004.jpg
is anything to go by.
ChristianG
28-12-2009, 03:06
On the subject of the Medusa snorkel mask, it was made by Cressi. See the Historical Diving Society of Italy file at
http://www.hdsitalia.com/articoli/20_attrezzature.pdf
Yep, there it is, mask no 24b. Note that, as I said, it is a full face mask, something hardly likely to be allowed today (ignoring the ping pong balls).
Thanks for that. :)
vBulletin v3.5.4, Copyright ©2000-2012, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.