WTD: valve gaurd for twinset

[large-ugly-greeny]

im after a valve gard for my twin 7's as i have now decided i am going to run them inverted
they are wider than a standard set of 7's and it is approximately 9 inches from the center of each cyclinder to the other the cylinders are Faber and they have a manifold
if anyone has a gaurd floating around in there garage give me a shout
cheers
Richard Green

[toniken]

hi, i used to dive my twin set inverted, military training and all that, beware! most of the valve guards are far too flimsy to take any weight at all, they are normally made mostly of aluminium, sit your set on them, they collapse!!
i bought a frame on ebay, i consisted of 1'' stainless square pipe. bolted to the back plate through the two bolts, you had a frame at the bottom to protect the valves, dived twin10's the frame was plenty strong enough to take twin 15's, if you had no sense!!. i'll see if i can find details of the maker, maybe if you google it. best of luck
ton y

[northern_diver]

Northern Diver-
http://www.twenga.co.uk/dir-Sports,Scuba-diving-and-spearfishing,Scuba-valve
http://www.sunderlandscubacentre.com/5732/Northern-Diver-Halo-Valve-Protector.html?referrer=froogle&utm_source=google&utm_medium=froogle&utm_campaign=pid5732
Custom Diver-
http://www.customdivers.com/protectors--lift-bars-46-c.asp
Review in magazine-
http://www.divemagazine.co.uk/news/article.asp?exp=1&uan=5323
Both companies offer good quality invert kits (ND from personal use/CD from word of mouth). Personally use mine, resting inverted on the bars all the time (as in often, not 24/7) with my twin 12's, with no issue. Used as lifting bar also.

ND abit cheaper than CD, but both fit for perpose. CD good customer after-sales care (never used either, word of mouth) and possibly better materials, but not sure.

John

[toniken]

Northern Diver-
http://www.twenga.co.uk/dir-Sports,Scuba-diving-and-spearfishing,Scuba-valve
http://www.sunderlandscubacentre.com/5732/Northern-Diver-Halo-Valve-Protector.html?referrer=froogle&utm_source=google&utm_medium=froogle&utm_campaign=pid5732
Custom Diver-
http://www.customdivers.com/protectors--lift-bars-46-c.asp
Review in magazine-
http://www.divemagazine.co.uk/news/article.asp?exp=1&uan=5323
Both companies offer good quality invert kits (ND from personal use/CD from word of mouth). Personally use mine, resting inverted on the bars all the time (as in often, not 24/7) with my twin 12's, with no issue. Used as lifting bar also.

ND abit cheaper than CD, but both fit for perpose. CD good customer after-sales care (never used either, word of mouth) and possibly better materials, but not sure.

John
john, not sure that this type of halo is suitable for inverting, the fixing is around the neck of the bottle, there's no way that an aluminium ring would be strong enough to take the weight of a twinset, remember, if you sit down suddenly, the weight hitting the bench could break the ring or even bend the bar, i suspect that the makers, if asked, would not reccomend use for inverting.
the bar that i used was made by a small engineering firm, i gave the details to john womack at dive warehouse, they seemed interested in the system, they may still have the details there.
tony

[large-ugly-greeny]

i was planning on securing the guard to the back plate of my wing via 2 or maybe 3 additional sections of solid steel rods that are then bolted to the guard as I've been prior warned about the guards flexing and the mounting brackets snapping of on a ruff rib ride to or from a site
debating welding my own up out of a section of 30mm solid stainless with attachment points to the back plate and then necks of the bottles.
will see if anyone has a spare kicking around in there shed first though
cheers
Richard

[northern_diver]

john, not sure that this type of halo is suitable for inverting, the fixing is around the neck of the bottle, there's no way that an aluminium ring would be strong enough to take the weight of a twinset, remember, if you sit down suddenly, the weight hitting the bench could break the ring or even bend the bar, i suspect that the makers, if asked, would not reccomend use for inverting.
the bar that i used was made by a small engineering firm, i gave the details to john womack at dive warehouse, they seemed interested in the system, they may still have the details there.
tony

Maybe, its worked so far, will have to look into the actual usage. Cheers. I've sent a e-mail to ND to see what they reckon out of interest, will post the reply.

John

[Nigel Hewitt]

john, not sure that this type of halo is suitable for inverting, the fixing is around the neck of the bottle, there's no way that an aluminium ring would be strong enough to take the weight of a twinset, remember, if you sit down suddenly, the weight hitting the bench could break the ring or even bend the bar, i suspect that the makers, if asked, would not reccomend use for inverting.
Well I've had the Custom Divers guard on a set of inverted 10/300s for years. It gets carried by the bar and gets bounced about inverted. I do hear that some people have had problems but I haven't.

It ain't Ali.

[large-ugly-greeny]

looks like i have found a set now they have a double support on the cylinder neck and i plan to make up a extra rod mounted of the center of the back plate
thanks for all the help

[Gareth]

looks like i have found a set now they have a double support on the cylinder neck and i plan to make up a extra rod mounted of the center of the back plate
thanks for all the help

The others have provided valuable advice, especially Nigel, who has actually dived this type of rig for some considerable time.

It is very very easy to damage the firststage & valves when using inverted sets. I have three branch members who dive inverted twinsets. The valve guards are all fitted to the twinning bands NOT to the cylinder neck. If the valve guard is connected to the neck it will not have sufficent strength. The valve guards are all made of Stainless steel, of a reasonable thickness. I am positive that you could drop them from 6ft & they would bounce. They where specially made, because they couldn't find anything they had any faith in!
In addition, you still need good access to the valves, & the manifold.

Remember that you will also probably need custom hoses.


Gareth

[northern_diver]

Remember that you will also probably need custom hoses.

Sadly in my case i do:( A few guys i know use a smaller hose with a inflator fitting, wich they just plug in it then makes it the correct lengh, without the custom hose....sort of. Adds another failure point but works.

John

[Fiona]

john, not sure that this type of halo is suitable for inverting, the fixing is around the neck of the bottle, there's no way that an aluminium ring would be strong enough to take the weight of a twinset, remember, if you sit down suddenly, the weight hitting the bench could break the ring or even bend the bar, i suspect that the makers, if asked, would not reccomend use for inverting.


I also used a CD halo on my twin 7's for several years, there was no problem with it, you need to maintain the halo frequently as the screws securing the ali rings tend to seize up. You do feel it flex when sitting down, but with all my dive kit I take care of it. Not saying it is the best piece of kit on the market but lots of people do use them.

[northern_diver]

Question Posed to Northern Diver-

Please would you be able to give me information as to the suitability of the 'Halo' twin set bars for supporting a inverted twin set. I have used this set up in the past without any concern with my twin 12's, but would like to know what your company suggest. Is the 'Halo' just a lifting handle or is it designed to be able to be used as a foot for inversion of the set, much as i've been doing since the 'Halo' was brought out.

Thanks and i look forward to your reply.

John Armstrong

Answer From Northern Diver-

Hi Johnny,

Thank you for your enquiry,

The halo is designed for the use it looks like you are using it for at the minute, you can use this inverted but would not recommend using it as a foot, if you was to turn the cylinders upside down the halo would more than take the weight of the cylinders however they would not be very sturdy on their own and wouldn’t act as a stand to leave them stood alone.
Is this what you are asking?

Kind regards,
Steve McSperritt
Retail Sales Manager

Cool:) I wouldnt test its bounce ability, but i reckon it would save the valves from a fall, even if it is at the expence of the frame (the pins at least).

Northern Diver got back to me in 2 days and offered advise on other issue, good customer service IMVHO

John

[large-ugly-greeny]

custom hoses i've been planning for i just need 2 long (200cm) regulator hoses (Poseidon cyclone) and a extended direct feed for my wing that i haven't measured yet but hoping they will be 150m as there cheaper as for suit feed i have a longish hose already for that that fits fine
debating if it is worth getting two 6 inch hp hoses for the gauges but i think i will just stick with the standard length ones to save money

also john thanks for firing the email of to northern diver totally agree excellent customer service and advice not totaly sure what you mean by plugging one hose into another to make it longer can you get a low pressure hose that is a male thread to a female thread or have i got the the wrong end of the stick on this one?

[northern_diver]

also john thanks for firing the email of to northern diver totally agree excellent customer service and advice not totaly sure what you mean by plugging one hose into another to make it longer can you get a low pressure hose that is a male thread to a female thread or have i got the the wrong end of the stick on this one?

As i understand it...

Using the same sort of fitting on the inflator (the air in/out male side) and the female opposite, you can increase the lengh of the low pressure hose.
Bascially you have a inflator hose and a hose with a reg on, which fit together using the inflator hose connect, mid 'line'/hose. As they are all low/medium pressure hoses, it doesnt matter, but the connection is an extra failure point.

I have limited experience of using these, havent fitted them myself, so i cant fully comment.

Northern Diver, along with AP valves have excellent cutomer service in my experience (thanks nick, BUDDY tech guy;) ), no worries large-ugly-greeny.

John

[Nigel Hewitt]

custom hoses i've been planning for i just need 2 long (200cm) regulator hoses (Poseidon cyclone) and a extended direct feed for my wing that i haven't measured yet but hoping they will be 150m as there cheaper as for suit feed i have a longish hose already for that that fits fine
200cm sounds a bit short to me was the supposed to be 2 meters. Mine were 5 foot and one was a couple of inches too short and the other a couple of inches too long but they worked and they were off-the-shelf.
My wing needed a 54 inch custom.
I ran the suit on a standard hose and had two standard SPGs which I clipped to the chest D-rings.
debating if it is worth getting two 6 inch hp hoses for the gauges but i think i will just stick with the standard length ones to save money You'll never see them.

Can I pimp my inverts page (http://www.nigelhewitt.co.uk/diving/rig.html) again? :D

[wallsy]

john, not sure that this type of halo is suitable for inverting, the fixing is around the neck of the bottle, there's no way that an aluminium ring would be strong enough to take the weight of a twinset, remember, if you sit down suddenly, the weight hitting the bench could break the ring or even bend the bar, i suspect that the makers, if asked, would not reccomend use for inverting.
the bar that i used was made by a small engineering firm, i gave the details to john womack at dive warehouse, they seemed interested in the system, they may still have the details there.
tony

I dive with cd halo allso with inverted 12's and these are heavy wall ones 15kg a pop dry weight, and have had no prob, even with my slight body;) dropping them down onto the bench after a dive. by the way I'm so graceful when I sit down NOT ask John:D

[northern_diver]

100% mate:) ;)

speaking of twins, that wing i got from kev is on its knees, looking for a replacement, know anyone?

talk to you 20th when i finally get back.

John