dive management

[Scuba232chick]

Hi all,

Im currently a BSAC sports diver + ADI with alot of expeirence regarding Training ect. I have a trip planned for a small group of members from my club however im the most experienced diver and highest qualification level on trip. The skipper on the boat is a BSAC advanced Instructor and runs a dive school however my club are saying this bloke cant be dive manager due to not being a member of our club. I dont know where i stand on this situation and am taking a regular thrashing from the club in relation to this. any advice???
Thanks
Shell

[Nigel Hewitt]

Im currently a BSAC sports diver + ADI with alot of expeirence regarding Training ect. I have a trip planned for a small group of members from my club however im the most experienced diver and highest qualification level on trip. The skipper on the boat is a BSAC advanced Instructor and runs a dive school however my club are saying this bloke cant be dive manager due to not being a member of our club. I dont know where i stand on this situation and am taking a regular thrashing from the club in relation to this. any advice???
That sounds about right to me.
I'd give you a hard time on that one too.

[David G]

I think this document from the bsac website may help with the situation a bit although it can seem a little confused:

http://www.bsac.com/core/core_picker/download.asp?id=10545

I think this section sums the 'problem' you have up:

DO may sanction all DL (and above) in club to organise and run branch dives to known locations without notification unless training is to be conducted or inexperienced members (eg Ocean Divers) are in attendance.


It is I'm sure very frustrating both for you and the others who want to go as there are often not enough people who are willing, like you are, to run a club trip.

HTH

David.

[Scuba232chick]

But i dont understand........ If we all got on a plane and went on holiday we could dive perfectly fine and no one would question a thing. so if i go to a weekend trip in the uk what exactly is the problem?? the skipper as i said does day charter as a BSAC dive school and dives are no deeper than 15-20 meters with a few being at 10m

[Gareth]

Shell

The problem relates to responsibility (in the event of anything going wrong).

The diving will be a branch dive. Therefore the responsibility rests with the branch , which means the diving officer, who the BSAC says has the ultimately responsibility to ensure all diving & training is carried out safely.

It is the DO's responsibility to ensure that the Dive Marshall is appropriately qualified to orgainise & run the trip.

The reason the Dive Leader Qualilfication is recommended is because at this level they have had training as to the responsibilities & duties of a Dive Marshall & practical experience & assesment of these skills. In addition, they will also have the required rescue skills, i.e. O2 Administrator, Practical Rescue Management skills.

Most Charters are done on the basis that the skipper is NOT taking responsibility for the diving. The Charter skipper is only taking responsibility for taking the divers to and from a specified site (or series of sites). The suitability of the site, the diving practices etc are all the responsidilities of the attending divers either individually, if they individually charter a space. Or the reponsibility of the individual, school, company, or branch that chartered the boat.

When you book with a holiday company, they take on a duty to ensure that the both the boat & the diving are carried out safely. It is standard practice that a professional diving guide is included, whose direct responsibility is to ensure the diving is safe & in the event of an incident hey have the responsibility of managing & resolving the incident (they also have liability insurance).

Can you not find a DL (or AD) to take on the duties of DM for this trip?


Gareth

PS. I can understand your frustration, & commend your enthusiasm. It is not the BSAC making things difficulty fo rthe sake of it. But attempting to ensure that all involved are protected, from trainee, ocean diver, sports diver etc.

[Nigel Hewitt]

But i dont understand........ If we all got on a plane and went on holiday we could dive perfectly fine and no one would question a thing. so if i go to a weekend trip in the uk what exactly is the problem?? the skipper as i said does day charter as a BSAC dive school and dives are no deeper than 15-20 meters with a few being at 10m
I think the point where we all went flakey on you is where you said that you were the highest qualified diver on the trip. If you get on a plane and go on holiday you will not get left to your own devices unless you have the proof that you are not going to be a problem.

I organised trips when I hadn't done twenty dives but I had the right people along and they knew everybody so we had the knowledge and the experience on board. You are offering a good guy back on the boat but he probably doesn't know any of you from Adam and I suspect that if you tell him you're having trouble from the DO over the trip you may discover he is not as 'on team' as you think.

Frankly if it was that simple we'd cross the bits of DL dealing with Dive Managing off the sylabus and save the time teaching it to go diving.

[Gareth]

Shell

I expect your DO is very pleased that you have made the effort to attempt to orgainised a trip.

Talk to him about helping you to find a DM.

Which region are you in?

You may well find that the regional coach can help you to find a DM.

Most of us are addicted to diving, if you give us the opportunity, we will often turn up for a bit of diving, even if we have to DM (or supervise the trainee DM:D ).

Gareth

[Janos]

Is the Skipper happy to take responsibility for you and your trip? If he's prepared to put it in an email, then I as DO would probably be happy.

You do need to be careful as there are some crap skippers out there. I'm sure anyone who's been diving a few years has their own story. Mine is a particular skipper who, when I asked him about the doubtful weather forecast agreed with me that it was 50/50 whether we were going out on the day, and that I would have final say on the morning. He then told two other divers booked on the boat (my club had 10 of the 12 spaces) that we were definitely going out and not to worry about it :eek: I ended up phoning around two or three other skippers I knew to give me advice.

Janos

[Andy (treerat)]

Where and when is the trip? - if it fits a diary you may well find a volunteer on here to act as your DM if you can't find one in your club.

Andy