Is there a BCD for big but not 'big'? [Archive]

TooTall

10-01-2009, 11:57

I'm looking for a new BCD for UK diving - I have a nice light Cressi for travel that does fine.

However - UK diving - drysuit - there is more of me, but not in the way manufacturers seem to think. I'm 6'7" tall with a 47" chest and 36" waist - so add a couple of inches for a dry+undersuit. I fit in the chest, but the waist always seems to be made for the more cuddly gentleman.

Dos anyone have knowledge of a BCD that has plenty of shoulder room but less at the waist? I end up with either side of the jacket touching in front of the cummerbund!

I've tried wings - currently dive in a wing - but only because I've not found a BCD that could work. I know it is heresy, but I prefer the BCD.

ChristianG

10-01-2009, 12:30

TooTall

10-01-2009, 13:30

Vic

10-01-2009, 13:42

You used the word 'revert'. I don't see it as a regressive step

I do.

I dive singles (12 or 15l)

Most of my BP/W diving was with singles. One of our club trainees is now diving that setup. It is entirely suitable for single-cylinder diving.

I just like the BCDs I have managed to use more than the wing and that is about all there is. I prefer the feel of them for me and the diving I do.

Than you probably haven't had the harness set up properly. That's usually the issue people have.

Back to the question - is there a BCD out there for a big bloke whose waist doesn't match his chest?

If you want tailored kit, you'll likely need to pay a tailor, or make it yourself...

Vic.

David Lisk

10-01-2009, 15:08

You used the word 'revert'. I don't see it as a regressive step, so we'll agree do differ and you can view me as wrong. I dive singles (12 or 15l) and I don't see myself going tech. I just like the BCDs I have managed to use more than the wing and that is about all there is. I prefer the feel of them for me and the diving I do.

For UK diving you are using a drysuit, since you are using 12/15 litre then you can use the drysuit for bouyancy, preferably with an autodump, then the wing/bcd is only for use on the surface or CBL. (I know others may not agree with using the suit for primary bouyancy but for the range of diving on a 12/15L, you are doing it is no problem).

As has been suggested you probably haven't had the wing harness set up properly you need an experienced technical diver to help you here. I think this is where the problem lies.

Maria CM

10-01-2009, 15:37

Could you ask a manufacturer to just swap for a smaller cummerbund? I know some have more or less slack in them for altering to get a good fit from the back....

Sorry - not much help.

Nothing wrong with a BC - I would guess that the majority of divers use them after all - very comfy and easy to use as a rule if they fit well (which most don't seem to) - dive in what suits YOU, not other people - part of being a grown-up is being able to make decisions for yourself, and, that decision being made and as you've said you prefer a BC to a wing I really don't see why you should use something you are not so keen on.

best wishes,

Maria

edit/ Italian manufacturers seem to cut narrower as a rule I think..

Roz

10-01-2009, 18:45

As advised previously it is quite possible that your harness is not as well adjusted as it could be, so you might want to seek advice first and get that sorted. If you've then dived your "sorted" harness and you really don't like it, then it's worth going shopping. I'm aware that the Seaquest Black Diamond is a very big BCD, http://www.divingshop.com/products/AQUALUNG_SEAQUEST_Black_Diamond_BCD_MEDIUM_283.asp x so this might be an alternative. I've dived a couple of Seaquest Jackets - Diva and Pro QD - and loved them. I've never had an opportunity to dive a Black Diamond, so can't comment on it, apart from knowing it's a big BCD.

However, you are currently diving a wing. If you are looking for more of a BCD experience, have you considered the OMS IQ Harness? http://www.omsdive.com/backplate.html (Figure #5 and # 6). This gives the wearer the feeling they are diving a BCD, it's very adjustable with useful breaks, and because it hails from the USA, it can accommodate both sexes in a huge variety of sizes. It's incredibly comfy to dive and great for travelling, and because of its design you cut a clean sleek figure through the water.

TooTall

10-01-2009, 23:22

Jeez vic - you are a real bundle of fun aren't you? I'm really glad I got to dive with open-minded people before I met a guru such as yourself online.

After all your rambling and finger-pointing, you could have just said 'no - I can't help with your fairly reasonable question' rather than picking holes and telling me I must be wrong. Are you always this helpful or just on the internet?

I accept that I'm in the 99th percentile for height and my shape / size doesn't fit most anything manufactured - as it is all for shorter more rotund people. I have my harness on my wing set up as well as it can be for me - and it has had more than the once over from several experienced divers. My drysuit, undersuit and wetsuits are all custom - I would just like a BCD for UK use too.

Vic

11-01-2009, 00:24

Jeez vic - you are a real bundle of fun aren't you? I'm really glad I got to dive with open-minded people before I met a guru such as yourself online.

Ah. Personal attacks. That's pleasant.

After all your rambling and finger-pointing

There was no such thing; I merely mentioned that your insistence on not diving a wing is what is going to cause you trouble and expense. Nowhere did I tell you you were wrong - just that I disagree with your initial assertion. If all you're looking for is agreement, you should have said; I thought you were after advice.

you could have just said 'no - I can't help with your fairly reasonable question'

I can help. I did help. I just didn't tell you what you wanted to hear.

rather than picking holes and telling me I must be wrong.

Show me again where I picked any holes, or even told you you were wrong.

Are you always this helpful or just on the internet?

I'm always as helpful as I can be. Sometimes people are helped best by being put off making a costly mistake.

I accept that I'm in the 99th percentile for height and my shape / size doesn't fit most anything manufactured - as it is all for shorter more rotund people.

...And therefore if you are looking for something manufactured, it's going to cost you money. LIke I said.

The alternative is to make something yourself, which will be cheaper and fit you at least as well - probably better. LIke I said.

I have my harness on my wing set up as well as it can be for me

That is the point I doubt - I have yet to see anyone that cannot have a harness fit to them such that it fits very well indeed. And yes - I have seen some strange shapes.

But if you refuse to consider that option - then that is your own lookout.

and it has had more than the once over from several experienced divers.

Are you claiming it is properly fitted?

My drysuit, undersuit and wetsuits are all custom - I would just like a BCD for UK use too.

Throw enough money at someone like AP and you can get a BC that will fit any shape you like.

Alternatively, you could save yourself many hundreds (or perhaps thousands) by taking an objective look at what you already have - even if that means revisiting decisions you thought you'd made.

Your choice. I couldn't care less.

Vic.

Dingham_rob

11-01-2009, 00:34

Hi Tootall

I sympathize with you regarding comments given not really answering your origional question, we've all been there!! The joys of the forum.... ;)

I dive with a Seaquest Pro XLT, I'm not as tall as you but otherwise not a long way off your dimensons. Theres loads of adjustment in every way you could want. The cumberbund will shorten and pockets are no where near touching. I'd recommend trying some of the Seaquest range at an LDS to see what you think. Certainly very well made jackets with loads of features.

Hope you find a jacket that suits you

Rob

Dave Woodward

11-01-2009, 00:45

Nick Argue

11-01-2009, 10:31

Hi Tootall

I dive with a Seaquest Pro XLT, I'm not as tall as you but otherwise not a long way off your dimensons. Theres loads of adjustment in every way you could want. The cumberbund will shorten and pockets are no where near touching. I'd recommend trying some of the Seaquest range at an LDS to see what you think. Certainly very well made jackets with loads of features.

Rob

Seac-Sub jackets also have a similar system where you can shorten/lengthen the shoulder/waist straps to suit a variety of sizes. I imagine they'll be others as well.

Maria CM

11-01-2009, 14:28

Seac-Sub jackets also have a similar system where you can shorten/lengthen the shoulder/waist straps to suit a variety of sizes. I imagine they'll be others as well.

I havee a Seac-Sub that does this but it's a lady's one so can't speak for mens. It is the best fit I found as having facility to alter and fit on nape to waist too.

best wishes,

Maria

Gasgow

11-01-2009, 15:19

[QUOTE=Dingham_rob]Hi Tootall

I sympathize with you regarding comments given not really answering your origional question, we've all been there!! The joys of the forum.... ;)

Totally agree, BSAC is in danger of putting off potential members and future divers with the 'thoughts' of some on this site.
Maybe these senior more experienced divers are trying to do just that! keep the seas for yourself syndrome?:p

I have to say that I have never enjoyed a sport so much and felt so belittled by others I should look up to.:(

Why do divers fell the need to be so arogant?
'If you prefer a wetsuit in the uk your an Idiot!'
'Prefering a BCD to a wing is backwards'

My advice to you (Tootall), and I know its sad, when it comes to kit don't bother asking questions on the forum, get down to a few dive shops or better still an event, and try some on.

Having said that, I have the opposite problem with a Buddy Sport, waste fits fine, and has adjustment both ways, but the chest strap is closed tight and the bc still moves about, Oh and before I get slagged off, my beer belly aint that bad im 46" chest and 36" waste.
Might be the best place to start.

Happy Diving:D

Gasgow

11-01-2009, 15:22

Where do you live, your welcome to try mine on. Think it may help your decision.

I'm looking for a new BCD for UK diving - I have a nice light Cressi for travel that does fine.

However - UK diving - drysuit - there is more of me, but not in the way manufacturers seem to think. I'm 6'7" tall with a 47" chest and 36" waist - so add a couple of inches for a dry+undersuit. I fit in the chest, but the waist always seems to be made for the more cuddly gentleman.

Dos anyone have knowledge of a BCD that has plenty of shoulder room but less at the waist? I end up with either side of the jacket touching in front of the cummerbund!

I've tried wings - currently dive in a wing - but only because I've not found a BCD that could work. I know it is heresy, but I prefer the BCD.

Steve Knight

11-01-2009, 15:26

I almost exclusively dive a wing out here, other than the odd rental BC, but when I came home at Christmas for a couple of dives, my mate lent me a brand new, new type Buddy Commando.

I've always been a big fan of Buddys, and still have my old profile an PABLJ and Dolphin Jacket here somewhere, but I was really amazed at how comfy this was with the new backplate etc. I really liked it.

Price wise it wasn't much more than one cost 10 years ago, and they have always been a good investment.

Dave

I am a big lad and have a new type Buddy Commando. It works well for me as there is plenty of lift and adjustment. I have to agree with the post above about comfort and quality. I dont think there is anything as good out there.

As for wings, if you dont like them dont use them

Steve

David Lisk

11-01-2009, 15:30

Glasgow

I sympathize with you regarding comments given not really answering your origional question, we've all been there!! The joys of the forum.... ;)

Rob

You have got to be joking, it was actually Tootall who made the personal comments "Jeez vic - you are a real bundle of fun aren't you? I'm really glad I got to dive with open-minded people before I met a guru such as yourself online."

Vic has been on the forum a long time with 1132 posts, and lots of sound advice, I note you have managed 7.

Gareth

11-01-2009, 15:43

Gasgow, TooTall

I am sorry you feel that you are 'belittled' or unhappy with the comments you recieve on the forum.

Whilst I do not always agree with those on this forum, I do not believe their are any regular posters on here that do not offer their advice without malice or dogma (the only area I know that sometimes cause the appearance of dogma is the DIR non DIR debates - even here we generally agree to differ in our opinions:D ). Generally, posts on this forum for the less experienced or new divers are done with the intention of assisting & encouraging, not to dismiss or degenrate.

Ultimately, we would all agree that you should do what you feel comfortable with, use the equipment that you feel confident in, & only dive within the limits of your comfort zone. However, if you ask advice, do not be surprised if does not match your wishes, or expectations!

Those with years of experience sometimes forget the difficulties of those new to the support, but, they have often seen mistakes, both in attitude, training & purchases that have needlessly adversly effected peoples enjoyment of this great Sport/Hobby.

As such most advice is given free, with the best intentions, you can accept or ignore it as you see fit.

I hope that you will continue to contribute to the forum, the diversity of views is what makes this forum such an interesting place to participate.

Gareth

Gasgow

11-01-2009, 16:04

Totally Agree, once again! this is becomming a habit of mine.;)

All I was pointing out is that, the guy has clearly stated that he preffers to use his BC, is that wrong? unsafe? a mistake? afterall thats what most of us trained in and used in our first adventures in this sport.

He also stated that he uses a wing, so he has experience of them and still he prefers his BC, is that wrong?

I peffer to use a wetsuit, and have been laughed at, belittled, and made out to be a fool by divers with 100000s of dives and posts, do they have the right to tell me that I'm cold?

If I was uncomfortable then I wouldn't dive, I have a dry suit, i preffer to use a wettie, I must be stupid!

Vic - I'm sorry that your comments have started this, I do believe you are trying to help.

Tootall- I understand your frustration.

All I am trying to point out is that, we are all divers, all different, all have opinions, but the way this forum resorts to the your right and your wrong attitude over an opinion is making us look bad to the newbie who is then bullied into doing something they don't like for fear of other divers!

27years, 2000+ games of football, still aint gonna tell Rooney his boots are sh*t! - nuff said?:D

Gasgow, TooTall

I am sorry you feel that you are 'belittled' or unhappy with the comments you recieve on the forum.

Whilst I do not always agree with those on this forum, I do not believe their are any regular posters on here that do not offer their advice without malice or dogma (the only area I know that sometimes cause the appearance of dogma is the DIR non DIR debates - even here we generally agree to differ in our opinions:D ). Generally, posts on this forum for the less experienced or new divers are done with the intention of assisting & encouraging, not to dismiss or degenrate.

Ultimately, we would all agree that you should do what you feel comfortable with, use the equipment that you feel confident in, & only dive within the limits of your comfort zone. However, if you ask advice, do not be surprised if does not match your wishes, or expectations!

Those with years of experience sometimes forget the difficulties of those new to the support, but, they have often seen mistakes, both in attitude, training & purchases that have needlessly adversly effected peoples enjoyment of this great Sport/Hobby.

As such most advice is given free, with the best intentions, you can accept or ignore it as you see fit.

I hope that you will continue to contribute to the forum, the diversity of views is what makes this forum such an interesting place to participate.

Gareth

Maria CM

11-01-2009, 16:54

I think there is a lot to be said for diplomacy....

Roz, for example, couched her suggestion about checking the wing out in a very diplomatic manner, and alternative wings that are more similar to BCs. There are some fantastically experienced people on this forum, some more diplomatic than others, that less experienced people (like myself) have loads to learn from and generally I am really grateful for all comments and assistance, whether it is what I want to hear or not.

However, there are a minority who are very dogmatic in their approach and come across very much as 'I am right, you are wrong' and it can be very offensive.

I really don't think validity on this forum relates to how many times you have posted; after all, I've posted loads of times and still babble a complete load of tosh half the time:) :rolleyes:

While I have been using this forum, it has made me laugh, it has made me think, it has made me question myself, it's made me really annoyed, BUT ONLY ONCE has anyone caused me to be in floods of tears at ridiculously regular intervals over the course of a couple of days, and believe me, I am really not the sort of person who takes things too seriously.

So... as I say.... it is nice to be nice to people.

best wishes,

Maria

Gasgow

11-01-2009, 17:36

Glasgow

You have got to be joking, it was actually Tootall who made the personal comments "Jeez vic - you are a real bundle of fun aren't you? I'm really glad I got to dive with open-minded people before I met a guru such as yourself online."

Vic has been on the forum a long time with 1132 posts, and lots of sound advice, I note you have managed 7.

David this is my point exactly - by the way, why write to me quoting someone else?

I may have not posted as often as Vic, I did not say Vic was wrong just simply said that Tootall and all others are allowed an opinion, which in turn isn't incorrect!
If we prefer one item of kit over another then thats fine, or should we all be sheep and do what the more regular posters tell us to do?

Once again a BSAC member is telling me that I don't count as I don't post as often as another, what is happening here?

We cant dive in the uk in wetsuits, Fact?
Wings are better than BCDs, Fact?
You cant carry cameras until you have 50+ dives, Fact?
a diver with 50 dives is better than a diver with 30, Fact?
your opinion doesn't matter if you haven't posted as often, Fact?

What a simple world in which we live, we have to do the same thing, wear the same kit, breathe the same gas as the more experienced diver, or we will all perish!

What happened to adventure?
Is that not why we do this?

Happy diver, not so Happy talking to divers.

Nigel Hewitt

11-01-2009, 18:53

We cant dive in the uk in wetsuits, Fact?
Wings are better than BCDs, Fact?
etc. etc. etc
These are all opinions. Everybody can have them.

If Vic, or I for that matter, express an opinion forcibly that doesn't make it anything other than opinion and doesn't stop you having and expressing contrary opinions.

I prefer a BC for diving a single but I also prefer not to dive singles. I get a lot of flack for saying that a wing with a single is a pretty daft idea because to some people their wing proves they have arrived as a diver. I have a ten year old Scubapro Club BCD but it won't fit the original poster.

Surprisingly I get very little criticism for saying I like solo deco wreck penetration rebreather diving when even I think I'm pushing it a bit doing that. But that's just my opinion.

Gasgow

11-01-2009, 19:56

These are all opinions. Everybody can have them.

If Vic, or I for that matter, express an opinion forcibly that doesn't make it anything other than opinion and doesn't stop you having and expressing contrary opinions.

I prefer a BC for diving a single but I also prefer not to dive singles. I get a lot of flack for saying that a wing with a single is a pretty daft idea because to some people their wing proves they have arrived as a diver. I have a ten year old Scubapro Club BCD but it won't fit the original poster.

Surprisingly I get very little criticism for saying I like solo deco wreck penetration rebreather diving when even I think I'm pushing it a bit doing that. But that's just my opinion.

Nigel, I have a lot of respect for you, and Vic for that matter, it seams that were all now agreeing that these are opinions, the point I needed to make!
It doesn't matter what someone else dives, we dive what we wan't because that what we enjoy.
Im happy throwing myself off my 3mtr RIB running a 9.9hp with a single 12 on a BC and only going to 12mtrs for 30mins, it makes me happy - not less of a diver.
The simple fact is that ALL divers should be encouraged what ever skill set, whatever kit they prefer. its our ocean and the more people that enjoy it the better we will protect it.
Lets all agree that we have our own opinion and have fun, on a zero viz sunday, arguing that we have different opinions, lets not tell someone how they must do this or that or make them feel less repected or less of a diver because of what they wear or what they don't.

Happy diving.

Gasgow

11-01-2009, 20:13

Nigel Hewitt

11-01-2009, 20:53

Surprisingly I get very little criticism for saying I like solo deco wreck penetration rebreather diving when even I think I'm pushing it a bit doing that. But that's just my opinion.
I think thats daft ;) (just an opinion, and the criticism your after????) but it certainly shows adventure, where do i sign up for that course? :D
But why is it daft?
I quite like a buddy along, if it's a friend, but if there is a problem on a dive like that I need to be in 'look after number one' mode so having somebody else along could be a liability too far.

And as for a course... Why would you want a course for that? It's either something you do or you don't do. I do courses to learn new skills while that is just the application of skills already learnt.

It's like carrying bailout gas on a CCR. There comes a point where you wonder if these dirty-great bailout tanks are earning their keep. Are the problems you get into because you are encumbered with them more than the problems you would face without them. I haven't quite got that far yet but I'm beginning to think that way.

None of this helps the poor guy looking for a jacket his shape but I'm still annoyed at Vic getting the cold shoulder for merely agreeing with a previous post. I may well disagree with him but his opinion is as valid as mine (even if he is wrong :rolleyes:). I think he's actually quite open minded but if the OP just wants people to agree with him the internet is a bad place to be. Vic is expressing a widely held belief.

johnyhog

11-01-2009, 23:09

who needs celebrity big brother with all this going on?::rolleyes: hang on I'm just going to the fridge for another tin of stella. and I love my buddy commando as much as my wing.:cool:

johnyhog

11-01-2009, 23:10

oh, and i've got 54 posts.:)

johnyhog

11-01-2009, 23:10

oh! 55.

Andy Moll (BSAC Council)

12-01-2009, 11:22

In answer to your question, try talking direct with buddy
(AP Diving Ambient Pressure Diving Ltd.
Water-Ma-Trout Industrial Estate
Helston
Cornwall
UK
TR13 0LW

Telephone:
+44 (0)1326 563 834)

, they did a custom one for me, and charged nothing extra for what they did, longer straps and rings in different locations.

That was quiet a few years ago though they did longer straps again at no extra charge on the replacement which is now 6 years old

ChristianG

12-01-2009, 12:19

None of this helps the poor guy looking for a jacket his shape but I'm still annoyed at Vic getting the cold shoulder for merely agreeing with a previous post. I may well disagree with him but his opinion is as valid as mine (even if he is wrong :rolleyes:). I think he's actually quite open minded but if the OP just wants people to agree with him the internet is a bad place to be. Vic is expressing a widely held belief.
I happened to make that previous post Nigel is referring to (Post #2 on this thread). The OP then took exception to my use of the word "revert" which in my books, and I have several dictionaries, simply means "go back to" but I refrained from further comment. As some of you would know I'm a bit of a wordsmith but I wasn't bothered to argue on a point of semantics.

Vic, in his usual somewhat forthright way that we all (should) know and love, then carried the ball further by simply agreeing with me. He added, rightly in my view, that a properly set up harness is a thing of beauty and a joy forever and that no harness should not fit. Now the OP is extremely tall and conjecture could be made that his harness is too short for him, I don't know, none of us do. But to again concur with Vic I have yet to find a harness, properly set up, which does not comfortably fit pretty well any diver, even if rigged in the GUE/DIR way which some find awkward. Me? I like that way but I have no problems with others that don't.

What we sometimes fail to remember, it seems to me, is that this is an unforgiving activity - get it wrong and the chances are that you could die or at least get seriously maimed. I always bear that in mind when someone delivers a rather forthright message. We are not, here, talking tiddlywinks.

David Lisk

12-01-2009, 18:49

David this is my point exactly - by the way, why write to me quoting someone else?

Once again a BSAC member is telling me that I don't count as I don't post as often as another, what is happening here?

Don't see where I said you don't count you are infering this from my reply. I am pointing out that Vic has made a substantial contribution, maybe a fact you do not want to recognise.

Also, I am not a BSAC member at at this point in time so, you are making an incorrect assumption as to me being a BSAC member.

I actually have qualifications from TDI, PADI and IANTD amongst others, so what?

Gasgow

12-01-2009, 21:47

[/QUOTE]What we sometimes fail to remember, it seems to me, is that this is an unforgiving activity - get it wrong and the chances are that you could die or at least get seriously maimed. I always bear that in mind when someone delivers a rather forthright message. We are not, here, talking tiddlywinks.[/QUOTE]

But wearing a BC in place of a wing won't kill you, will it?
If it does then I'd say 80% of sports divers are Fu*ked.

My point is that divers with little experience, need more of an explanation, not just the forthright comment that what they are doing is wrong, especialy in this case where it it truly unlikely to put him in danger if he choses BC over Wing.

As Nigel points out above - he is considering ditching his bail outs as they are cumbersome and uncomfortable, I think that is more risky than switching from a wing to a BC.

Now whilst Nigel has his point of view with regards to solo wrecking on a re-brether at 100mtrs without a bail out, no-one dares to question him.

I would not tell him forthrightly (or forthwrongly) that he should not do that.
But most of the more experienced divers on this forum are happy to tell the newbie, or unexperienced diver what they should do without explaining the options and giving choice.

Can this guy not choose to Revert to a BC?
I think he had made up his own mind previously.
I think he was short with VIC and shouldn't have been.
I think he was fed up with being told what he should do when he has clearly stated that he didn't want to do it.

TooTall -BCDs used properly- they won't kill ya
Telling people about the kind of diving you do outside of the rule book, on a forum open to all, without telling them what training they should get - may just kill them.

Gasgow

12-01-2009, 21:55

Don't see where I said you don't count you are infering this from my reply. I am pointing out that Vic has made a substantial contribution, maybe a fact you do not want to recognise.

Also, I am not a BSAC member at at this point in time so, you are making an incorrect assumption as to me being a BSAC member.

I actually have qualifications from TDI, PADI and IANTD amongst others, so what?

You are a memeber of BSAC forums, are you not?
You imply that Vics opinion is worth more than mine as he has posted more often, do you not?
What do you qualifications have to do with mine or Vics opinion?
I have no issue with Vic, you appear to have one with me!
what part of my opinion do you dissagree with?

Gasgow

12-01-2009, 22:00

oh! 55.

My kinda guy. LOL

oh and well impressed with yer number of posts! but if this goes on much longer I'll be worth more than you nananananana!

16 and counting! :D

Nigel Hewitt

12-01-2009, 23:01

You imply that Vics opinion is worth more than mine as he has posted more often, do you not?
It's an opinion so he's entitled to it.

Personally I judge people's merit not on their number of posts but totally on their use or misuse of punctuation. One missed apostrophe and your diving qualifications and experience count for naught, you are obviously an idiot.

I get my punctuation wrong and I am an idiot so that proves I'm right.

johnyhog

12-01-2009, 23:05

57:D

Tony Watson

13-01-2009, 00:06

Budy make the biggest size range of BCDs for large folk good luck

ChristianG

13-01-2009, 06:45

I said, and you quoted:

What we sometimes fail to remember, it seems to me, is that this is an unforgiving activity - get it wrong and the chances are that you could die or at least get seriously maimed. I always bear that in mind when someone delivers a rather forthright message. We are not, here, talking tiddlywinks.
But wearing a BC in place of a wing won't kill you, will it?
If it does then I'd say 80% of sports divers are Fu*ked.
My comment was a general one not directed at this thread in particular however, perhaps you did not understand that.

As for this thread, there have been a number of people in high dudgeon, TooTall and, yes, you included (inter alia). What started out as a mild "why?" (well, IMO anyway) has now finished up as a fully fledged flame war which is going nowhere - as all flame wars tend to do.

What the defenders of the BCD, yourself for one, fail to apparently realise is that there is a pretty large body of people out there who consider that a properly set up wing can, and will, do the job - regardless of body dimensions. What the defenders of the BCD, yourself for one, fail to apparently realise is that there are people out there who question the validity of reverting to a BCD (including inherent costs) simply because the diver cannot get comfortable with the wing. What the defenders of the BCD, yourself for one, fail to apparently realise is that a BCD is rather less likely to be able to accommodate a difficult body shape, whereas a wing is significantly more adjustable.

There now, does that spell it out? I'm outta here, this is getting to be absurd.

Gasgow

13-01-2009, 09:33

I said, and you quoted:

My comment was a general one not directed at this thread in particular however, perhaps you did not understand that.

As for this thread, there have been a number of people in high dudgeon, TooTall and, yes, you included (inter alia). What started out as a mild "why?" (well, IMO anyway) has now finished up as a fully fledged flame war which is going nowhere - as all flame wars tend to do.

What the defenders of the BCD, yourself for one, fail to apparently realise is that there is a pretty large body of people out there who consider that a properly set up wing can, and will, do the job - regardless of body dimensions. What the defenders of the BCD, yourself for one, fail to apparently realise is that there are people out there who question the validity of reverting to a BCD (including inherent costs) simply because the diver cannot get comfortable with the wing. What the defenders of the BCD, yourself for one, fail to apparently realise is that a BCD is rather less likely to be able to accommodate a difficult body shape, whereas a wing is significantly more adjustable.

There now, does that spell it out? I'm outta here, this is getting to be absurd.

Absurd, I agree - I'm not a defender of the BC, just of choice. I understand fully your comments, I am now completly disillusioned with BSAC 'forum' divers, why question my understanding, do you find the need to try to make me look stupid?
Climb out from your own arse for a minute, get a sence of humour, and don't make out that your opinions are they only ones that matter, then when someone questions them, spout a load of bollocks stating you only said it because people die doing this sport.
Scaremongers have no use, Vic had a use, you do not.

Gasgow

13-01-2009, 09:37

It's an opinion so he's entitled to it.

Personally I judge people's merit not on their number of posts but totally on their use or misuse of punctuation. One missed apostrophe and your diving qualifications and experience count for naught, you are obviously an idiot.

I get my punctuation wrong and I am an idiot so that proves I'm right.

And Im entitled to mine. (yet another apostrophe missed, I know, idiot!)

Maria CM

13-01-2009, 09:44

Absurd, I agree - I'm not a defender of the BC, just of choice. I understand fully your comments, I am now completly disillusioned with BSAC 'forum' divers, why question my understanding, do you find the need to try to make me look stupid?
Climb out from your own arse for a minute, get a sence of humour, and don't make out that your opinions are they only ones that matter, then when someone questions them, spout a load of bollocks stating you only said it because people die doing this sport.
Scaremongers have no use, Vic had a use, you do not.

Ouch - naughty words:eek: All getting rather personal....:(

I think this is all getting a bit out of hand.

I really think the same issues apply to BCs as wings. They are both far better if they fit properly, however, a wing that doesn't fit properly is a bit of a disaster and a BC that doesn't fit properly is just annoying.

I have a short nape to waist measurement and as such was really happy when I got some good advice and it was suggested that for my shape and size the SeacSub would be the best fit. It is for me and I love it.

I had a complete disaster with a chronically badly set up wing, then the lovely Gareth assisted and I was no longer put off them and found it quite comfortable. I suspect at some point I shall change to wing and twins for UK diving (dosh dependent:( ), but I will make sure I get someone very experienced to go through all the alternatives with me before I buy. I am however, fully expecting that I will get an OMS because I prefer the feel of a BC cummerbund and the padding on the shoulder straps.

The fact remains though, that the OP specifically asked for help finding a BC to fit his build - I was chuffed to bits when I was directed to mine in the shop as it makes my diving a far more relaxed experience as it is a really good fit. I don't like them feeling loose or the resultant back pain from the torso length being wrong. Ivery much doubt I would ever change from a BC for warm water diving though, just for the ease of putting it on etc.

best wishes and can we all be nice to each other now please?

Maria