Pre 95 Advanced Diver

[Gary Cameron]

I have been collecting log books in for verification and have found that one chap has completed all the very old advanced diver stuff except the rescue. It seems a shame to not count this training. (This is the pre SDC AD qualification)

Is there any way that that I can get this signed off or use the training for the new system.

Any info would be helpful.

Regards

Gary Cameron

[Mike Halligan]

Edward,

This matter was not included in the draft of the BOH amendment. The draft dealt with training started under the silver manual, i.e. the 1995 syllabus.

Gary is asking about the pre-1995 syllabus. Did the BSAC record,or does anyone know, what was said in 1995 when that same silver manual was introduced?

Mike

Gary

This is a topic that has been included in the soon to be posted BOH amendment.

Diver qualification training started before 30 September 2002 has (currently) no end or completion date. Therefore your chap just requires rescue (from the 1995 syllabus) and the new elements of the 2002 syllabus, before you sign it off.

You have off-forum mail.

Edward

:=I have been collecting log books in for verification and have found that one chap has completed all the very old advanced diver stuff except the rescue. It seems a shame to not count this training. (This is the pre SDC AD qualification)
:=
:=Is there any way that that I can get this signed off or use the training for the new system.
:=
:=Any info would be helpful.
:=
:=Regards
:=
:=Gary Cameron

[edward haynes]

Thanks Mike

That's why I need proof readers to keep me on the straight and narrow.

In that case there was a cut off date.

Gary

Contact Jim Watson at HQ and ask for some guidance.

mailto: jimw @ bsac dot com

Edward

[crofty]

I believe the cut off date was October 97
I remember a mad rush in our club to get a load completed in time

Richard

>Thanks Mike

That's why I need proof readers to keep me on the straight and narrow.

In that case there was a cut off date.

Gary

Contact Jim Watson at HQ and ask for some guidance.

mailto: jimw @ bsac dot com

Edward

[terryh]

I believe the cut off date was October 97
I remember a mad rush in our club to get a load completed in time

Richard


Regardless of the actual cut-off date, unless the guy has
regularly done O2, DPM, PRM/Rescue etc. He is hardly likely
to be up to speed after 7-10 years.

That's why it's best to look at all these cut-off dates with a
pinch of salt (no pun intended). Even if it was Nov 97, I would
look long and hard at signing somebody up without decent
refresher training.

TerryH

[Mike Halligan]

Regardless of the actual cut-off date, unless the guy has
regularly done O2, DPM, PRM/Rescue etc. He is hardly likely
to be up to speed after 7-10 years.

That's why it's best to look at all these cut-off dates with a
pinch of salt (no pun intended). Even if it was Nov 97, I would
look long and hard at signing somebody up without decent
refresher training.

Terry,

As would I were I a DO, and as I do as DM but ................
(to save Dave bothering) can I point out that if the candidate meets the criteria, which are having a variety of things signed up, then the qualification must be awarded?

Accordingly, it does matter (very much) that a cut-off was applied to the pre-1995 syllabus. This person, after a 7-10 year gap does not meet the criteria.

What must be done with the 1995 syllabus is laid out carefully in the BOH amendment alluded to by Edward higher up this thread. If a DO applies the sequence laid down in the silver manual, the likelihood of a problem such as you suggest is reduced. However, is there any difference in one's skills becoming rusty by neglect before or after the DO signs a piece of paper?

There is a defence similar to the MOT tester's defence. The DO certifies that the candidate satisfies the requirements. The DO does not certify that the candidate is necessarily fit or capable in all aspects at the time of signing or at any other time.

Regards,


Mike

[terryh]

:=Regardless of the actual cut-off date, unless the guy has
:=regularly done O2, DPM, PRM/Rescue etc. He is hardly likely
:=to be up to speed after 7-10 years.
:=
:=That's why it's best to look at all these cut-off dates with a
:=pinch of salt (no pun intended). Even if it was Nov 97, I would
:=look long and hard at signing somebody up without decent
:=refresher training.

Terry,

As would I were I a DO, and as I do as DM but ................
(to save Dave bothering) can I point out that if the candidate meets the criteria, which are having a variety of things signed up, then the qualification must be awarded?


Not quite.

While it is true that if he has passed all the criteria he is
supposed to be signed up, there is a getout clause in the BOH
which states that if you doubt the standard you can (as DO)
refuse to sign. Yes it may go to committee and HQ etc, but
if eg. he hasnt done any O2 since 97 then awarding him the
grade now, isnt going to do you or your fellow divers much
good if your relying on him as the only trained O2 guy on
the boat!

Bottom line here is that the DO can refuse to sign anything.
He might have to awnser to all and sundry and he might even be
voted off by the committee, but as a check for quality/
standards he has that right.

TerryH

[Mike Halligan]

:=:=Regardless of the actual cut-off date, unless the guy has
:=:=regularly done O2, DPM, PRM/Rescue etc. He is hardly likely
:=:=to be up to speed after 7-10 years.
:=:=
:=:=That's why it's best to look at all these cut-off dates with a
:=:=pinch of salt (no pun intended). Even if it was Nov 97, I would
:=:=look long and hard at signing somebody up without decent
:=:=refresher training.
:=
:=Terry,
:=
:=As would I were I a DO, and as I do as DM but ................
:=(to save Dave bothering) can I point out that if the candidate meets the criteria, which are having a variety of things signed up, then the qualification must be awarded?
:=

Not quite.

While it is true that if he has passed all the criteria he is
supposed to be signed up, there is a getout clause in the BOH
which states that if you doubt the standard you can (as DO)
refuse to sign. Yes it may go to committee and HQ etc, but
if eg. he hasnt done any O2 since 97 then awarding him the
grade now, isnt going to do you or your fellow divers much
good if your relying on him as the only trained O2 guy on
the boat!

Bottom line here is that the DO can refuse to sign anything.
He might have to awnser to all and sundry and he might even be
voted off by the committee, but as a check for quality/
standards he has that right.

Terry,

No, the bottom line is that he is a pre-95 student, can continue as such no longer and cannot be signed up anyway.

His DO may negotiate certain byes in the 2002 syllabus if he so chooses, though as you rightly state the candidate may be no longer current. (He could equally be bang up to date, practicing weekly, and saving lives all over the show).

We can interpret this differently forever, but I shan't. I would re-iterate that a diver can become as rusty after qualification as before, therefore the date of award cuts no ice with me (individually) as a DM. (Entirely IMHO, of course)


Regards,

Mike