How Do I Help??? [Archive] - BSAC Scuba Diving Forums

Barry Goss

04-04-2003, 23:46

TerryH

05-04-2003, 01:30

I'm a BSAC OWI, I've assisted and taught on 3 combined nitrox courses now, both run in branch and out of branch.
Very recently I approached the area coach in order to assist, and gain my ticket, to teach on another.

I was turned down.....
I later found out the course was not run because of a lack of instructors/assistants.

I dive twin twelves and a side slung 7L alu. all of which the area coach knows

In the past the area coach and I have had a difference of opinions. (the usual stuff JK will know what I mean)

So how do I offer me assistance in a way BSAC will respond to. I want to help.
Cheers
Barry

Dont understand are you actually a Nitrox Instructor?
If you have assisted and you are an OWI then you should be able
to get the ticket now.

As for helping out, try BSAC HQ. The actual BSAC areas are in
many cases not logical, geographical speaking (just look at
Southern). You might find that a "next door" coach has a
different attitude.

If you still need an "assist" ther are many courses goping on
all the time where help would be welcomed.

Where exactly in the country are you?

TerryH

Steve Walker

06-04-2003, 13:52

I'm a BSAC OWI, I've assisted and taught on 3 combined nitrox courses now, both run in branch and out of branch.
Very recently I approached the area coach in order to assist, and gain my ticket, to teach on another.

I was turned down.....
I later found out the course was not run because of a lack of instructors/assistants.

I dive twin twelves and a side slung 7L alu. all of which the area coach knows

In the past the area coach and I have had a difference of opinions. (the usual stuff JK will know what I mean)

So how do I offer me assistance in a way BSAC will respond to. I want to help.
Cheers
Barry

Do not pass go, do not collect ?200, go directly to HQ ;) see link for a list of contacts.
Although the specifics of your situation may be unusual, the general problem isn't i.e. keen instructors being held back by what seems to be political BS, I'm sure you'll find that HQ will be only too happy to try and find a solution for you.
HTH

John Williams

06-04-2003, 16:18

Do not pass go, do not collect ?200, go directly to HQ ;) see link for a list of contacts.
Although the specifics of your situation may be unusual, the general problem isn't i.e. keen instructors being held back by what seems to be political BS, I'm sure you'll find that HQ will be only too happy to try and find a solution for you.
HTH

Steve,

You KNOW that's not entirley fair!

There is some political BS about...but when you have approached the Regional Coaching Scheme directly you have received nothing but prompt and effective support.

Personality clashes will ALWAYS occur - all you need to do is manage them, or go around them.

The first port of call if you get no joy from your Area Coach would be to your Regional Coach. If you go straight to HQ - missing out this step you will simply be referred back to the Regional Coach by HQ. You don't want to start off on the wrong foot by upsetting the Regional Coach..so go to him/her direct.

This method worked for you with past problems...and you have yet to test it for validity this year.

John

Steve Walker

06-04-2003, 20:59

Steve,

You KNOW that's not entirley fair!

There is some political BS about...but when you have approached the Regional Coaching Scheme directly you have received nothing but prompt and effective support.

Very true John, I have indeed received such excellent support from my Regional Coach, as well you know, no slur upon him was intended, as you will see from the rest of the post.

It seems you have inadvertently misunderstood the intention of my post, but at the same time have raised an extremely interesting point (apologies in advance to those who dislike pedantism or overly precise grammar).

When Barry wrote 'area coach' I took this to mean "Regional Coach" hence my suggestion to go to the next level, which AFAIK would be HQ.

However... you wrote "Area Coach" (ie a proper-noun) which prompted me to look at the "Round The Regions" section of bsac.org. Lo and behold...I find that my region has a selection of designated Area Coaches, as distinct from the Regional Coach.

So how could I make such an apparently fundamental error?
I must be either new to BSAC or some kind of retiring "wallflower" character who doesn't like to get involved in branch activities.

Actually no, I've been a BSAC member for six years, I'm an OWI (was CI for two years before that), I was a branch Chairman for two years and TO for another year after that, not to mention a consequent but very fleeting stint as DO (all in the same branch).

In all that time I never once met 'in person' the appropriate Area Coach responsible for that particular club. Although I did once see him at our Regional Conference, where he was making a presentation; I was in the audience completely unaware of his Area Coach relationship to the branch I was then on the committee of.

Seems like Darin Edwards has a better point than I had realised when he spoke about training courses for branch officers...

Regards
Steve

Barry Goss

06-04-2003, 21:45

:=Do not pass go, do not collect ?200, go directly to HQ ;) see link for a list of contacts.
:=Although the specifics of your situation may be unusual, the general problem isn't i.e. keen instructors being held back by what seems to be political BS, I'm sure you'll find that HQ will be only too happy to try and find a solution for you.
:=HTH

Steve,

You KNOW that's not entirley fair!

There is some political BS about...but when you have approached the Regional Coaching Scheme directly you have received nothing but prompt and effective support.

Personality clashes will ALWAYS occur - all you need to do is manage them, or go around them.

The first port of call if you get no joy from your Area Coach would be to your Regional Coach. If you go straight to HQ - missing out this step you will simply be referred back to the Regional Coach by HQ. You don't want to start off on the wrong foot by upsetting the Regional Coach..so go to him/her direct.

This method worked for you with past problems...and you have yet to test it for validity this year.

John

Thanks,

Although, I fear I may have had my coaches the wrong way round. the A.C. is ok, the R.C. seems to be my prob. Still, being in an area where 3 other regions are accessable within 20mins driving, opens up my options. I'll try another region.
Cheers
Barry

david Taylor

07-04-2003, 14:19

I only occaisionally have time to read these forums, (strict boss!) but I hoped to throw in my twopence worth. I was in my current branch for 8 years before I found out that a regional team existed. I started attending Skill Development courses and after 3 or 4 began to recognise some instructor faces, as well as some regular faces from other branches. This led to these regional instructors encouraging me to become an instructor myself. Ulterior motive was to get me teaching on regional SDC's!! However had I continued training within my branch, these opportunities would have been lost.
Now as regional coach for the North East, I and others on the coaching team look forward to being INVITED to branches to try to identify potential instructors or we look closely at the candidates on SDC's to try and find 'new blood' to ensure that a larger section of the clubs in the region have some contact with the regional coaching team, by having thier members working at that level.
In the north east the regional coaching team has assistant instrucors to national instructors all working for the region, and we welcome all volunteers some not even from the north east!)and will do all we can to help people develop as divers and instructors, mainly because I was in the same situation and someone did it for me.
If you want to help, just ask.If you get no or poor response, ask someone else on the coaching team until eventually someone says yes
David

:=:=Do not pass go, do not collect ?200, go directly to HQ ;) see link for a list of contacts.
:=:=Although the specifics of your situation may be unusual, the general problem isn't i.e. keen instructors being held back by what seems to be political BS, I'm sure you'll find that HQ will be only too happy to try and find a solution for you.
:=:=HTH
:=
:=Steve,
:=
:=You KNOW that's not entirley fair!
:=
:=There is some political BS about...but when you have approached the Regional Coaching Scheme directly you have received nothing but prompt and effective support.
:=
:=Personality clashes will ALWAYS occur - all you need to do is manage them, or go around them.
:=
:=The first port of call if you get no joy from your Area Coach would be to your Regional Coach. If you go straight to HQ - missing out this step you will simply be referred back to the Regional Coach by HQ. You don't want to start off on the wrong foot by upsetting the Regional Coach..so go to him/her direct.
:=
:=This method worked for you with past problems...and you have yet to test it for validity this year.
:=
:=
:=John

Thanks,

Although, I fear I may have had my coaches the wrong way round. the A.C. is ok, the R.C. seems to be my prob. Still, being in an area where 3 other regions are accessable within 20mins driving, opens up my options. I'll try another region.
Cheers
Barry

Sarah Gauci Carlton

10-04-2003, 16:51

I only occaisionally have time to read these forums, (strict boss!) but I hoped to throw in my twopence worth. I was in my current branch for 8 years before I found out that a regional team existed. I started attending Skill Development courses and after 3 or 4 began to recognise some instructor faces, as well as some regular faces from other branches. This led to these regional instructors encouraging me to become an instructor myself. Ulterior motive was to get me teaching on regional SDC's!! However had I continued training within my branch, these opportunities would have been lost.
Now as regional coach for the North East, I and others on the coaching team look forward to being INVITED to branches to try to identify potential instructors or we look closely at the candidates on SDC's to try and find 'new blood' to ensure that a larger section of the clubs in the region have some contact with the regional coaching team, by having thier members working at that level.
In the north east the regional coaching team has assistant instrucors to national instructors all working for the region, and we welcome all volunteers some not even from the north east!)and will do all we can to help people develop as divers and instructors, mainly because I was in the same situation and someone did it for me.
If you want to help, just ask.If you get no or poor response, ask someone else on the coaching team until eventually someone says yes
David

:=:=:=Do not pass go, do not collect ?200, go directly to HQ ;) see link for a list of contacts.
:=:=:=Although the specifics of your situation may be unusual, the general problem isn't i.e. keen instructors being held back by what seems to be political BS, I'm sure you'll find that HQ will be only too happy to try and find a solution for you.
:=:=:=HTH
:=:=
:=:=Steve,
:=:=
:=:=You KNOW that's not entirley fair!
:=:=
:=:=There is some political BS about...but when you have approached the Regional Coaching Scheme directly you have received nothing but prompt and effective support.
:=:=
:=:=Personality clashes will ALWAYS occur - all you need to do is manage them, or go around them.
:=:=
:=:=The first port of call if you get no joy from your Area Coach would be to your Regional Coach. If you go straight to HQ - missing out this step you will simply be referred back to the Regional Coach by HQ. You don't want to start off on the wrong foot by upsetting the Regional Coach..so go to him/her direct.
:=:=
:=:=This method worked for you with past problems...and you have yet to test it for validity this year.
:=:=
:=:=
:=:=John
:=
:=Thanks,
:=
:=Although, I fear I may have had my coaches the wrong way round. the A.C. is ok, the R.C. seems to be my prob. Still, being in an area where 3 other regions are accessable within 20mins driving, opens up my options. I'll try another region.
:=Cheers
:=Barry
:=
:=

In defence of BSAC, and regional coaches: The Club I belong to is in Malta and our Regional Coach is the West Midlands Coach, Mike Crampton (don't ask what relationship Malta has to the West Midlands). We have had nothing but help from him and other senior instructors from the UK, despite the distances involved. If you get no joy out of one local coach, find another, in our experience the vast majority are a brilliant bunch who will do everything in their power to help:-)

john dunwell

22-04-2003, 00:28

Chris King

29-04-2003, 18:23

I'm not sure our branch has ever seen our Area Coach or Regional Coach in the 4 years that I've been a member, and I've been on the committe most of that time!

:=Steve,
:=
:=You KNOW that's not entirley fair!
:=
:=There is some political BS about...but when you have approached the Regional Coaching Scheme directly you have received nothing but prompt and effective support.

Very true John, I have indeed received such excellent support from my Regional Coach, as well you know, no slur upon him was intended, as you will see from the rest of the post.

It seems you have inadvertently misunderstood the intention of my post, but at the same time have raised an extremely interesting point (apologies in advance to those who dislike pedantism or overly precise grammar).

When Barry wrote 'area coach' I took this to mean "Regional Coach" hence my suggestion to go to the next level, which AFAIK would be HQ.

However... you wrote "Area Coach" (ie a proper-noun) which prompted me to look at the "Round The Regions" section of bsac.org. Lo and behold...I find that my region has a selection of designated Area Coaches, as distinct from the Regional Coach.

So how could I make such an apparently fundamental error?
I must be either new to BSAC or some kind of retiring "wallflower" character who doesn't like to get involved in branch activities.

Actually no, I've been a BSAC member for six years, I'm an OWI (was CI for two years before that), I was a branch Chairman for two years and TO for another year after that, not to mention a consequent but very fleeting stint as DO (all in the same branch).

In all that time I never once met 'in person' the appropriate Area Coach responsible for that particular club. Although I did once see him at our Regional Conference, where he was making a presentation; I was in the audience completely unaware of his Area Coach relationship to the branch I was then on the committee of.

Seems like Darin Edwards has a better point than I had realised when he spoke about training courses for branch officers...

Regards
Steve

John Williams

30-04-2003, 09:21

I'm not sure our branch has ever seen our Area Coach or Regional Coach in the 4 years that I've been a member, and I've been on the committe most of that time!

Have you ever invited them to come along and tell you what they can offer to the branch?

The Coaching Scheme tends to provide more support to those who need it most - so branches that are operating well, or do not ask for contact, sometimes get forgotten whilst Coaches are busy helping those who ask for help.

That being said - a Coach should visit at least once a year ...just to give you the opportunity to raise any issues that are concerning you, keep you updated on BSAC issues and offer you a forum for discussion and feedback.

Give your Regional Coach a ring and ask whoour Area Coach is before inviting BOTH of them down to re-introduce the scheme to all of the branch.

John

Trevor M

30-04-2003, 13:59

Have you ever invited them to come along and tell you what they can offer to the branch?

Is it the branch's responsibility? Surely the onus is on the Coach, as they are responsible for coordination interbranch events?

T

Mike Halligan

30-04-2003, 15:05

Is it the branch's responsibility? Surely the onus is on the Coach, as they are responsible for coordination interbranch events?

I am not an Area or Regional Coach but I do know some, and I beg to differ. I don't believe there is onus upon anyone. Our coaches need no defence, but they are probably too polite to put their case. They give of their time and efforts extensively, arranging and publicising regional training and instructor events, frequently also offering regional meetings. Need they do more?

If we wish to organise along BSAC lines, affiliate and call ourselves BSAC clubs, do we not also have a responsibility to partake of (or at least observe) these goodies and thereby to inform ourselves? The Coaches are more than adequately publicised, it seems to me, and whilst some occasionally (and rightly) sound off under extreme provocation, I have never met one yet who is other than charming the vast majority of the time.

If you're feeling unsupported, have you spoken with HQ? HQ will convey any concern voiced to the right person in the right way - and action will be forthcoming. It may seem that the loudest chick is fed, but no coach avoids the duty of support. The antagonism persisting in some Branches will always prey at the back of peoples minds so I do not question the reticence of some in making fresh contacts with undemanding Branches.

Regards,

Mike
ex-ADO, SDC Instructor

Steve Walker

30-04-2003, 20:20

The Coaches are more than adequately publicised, it seems to me

Gotta disagree there Mike, for the reasons I gave in my earlier post in this thread. I'm not entirely sure how it could be best accomplished, but there is room for making members aware that the Regional folk are there to help things along at a variety of levels, and not just concerned with Regional SDCs or major training events
Regards
Steve

Mike Halligan

30-04-2003, 21:55

Hi, Steve,

My experience has been only of interested support with better than adequate publicity for all events, not only SDCs and training but organisational help and encouraging mutual asistance between Branches - all with minimal active contact from the Coaches.

I have found it more than sufficient over a period of some 8 years, spanning the tenure of 3 Regional Coaches and several more Area Coaches. This will always be a subjective matter. This website, BOH, exhibition stands and HQ all encourage the Branch to call the shots. That works for me and not for you, which is a pity.

Regards,

Mike

Keith Lawrence(BSAC)

30-04-2003, 22:02

:=I'm not sure our branch has ever seen our Area Coach or Regional Coach in the 4 years that I've been a member, and I've been on the committe most of that time!

Have you ever invited them to come along and tell you what they can offer to the branch?

I have to agree with John here Chris, our coaches have a lot of excellent qualities but not too many of them are psychic :-) Some area/regional coaches do arrange regular visits, some branches see this as a ?checking up? (it isn?t), they just can?t win!

Why not invite your area/regional coach down to a club evening? They will be delighted to explain how the regional scheme can help individual divers and clubs, how your can get involved in regional events (could you host a regional SDC for instance?), maybe put you in touch with some other clubs in the area to share resources.

The regional teams are there to help, if you want it. Most work on a ?by invitation? basis so all you have to do is ask.

Regards

Keith L

p.s. I heard this ?we never hear from the BSAC? several times when I?ve visited clubs, often if I?m out-and-about and just pop in for a social visit. The conversation normally goes something like this?

KL : Hi, I?m Keith, I was in the area so I thought I?d pop in.
DO : Well! We don?t normally get visits from people like you, we?ve never had a visit from HQ or from a Council member.
KL : That surprises me, when did you last ASK for a visit?
DO : Well? errr? we?ve never actually asked for a visit?

Steve Walker

01-05-2003, 14:05

Mike, I was going to reply to you off-line but seems like your e-mail address has changed from the one stated in your profile
Regards
Steve

Mike Halligan

01-05-2003, 14:58

Mike, I was going to reply to you off-line but seems like your e-mail address has changed from the one stated in your profile
Regards
Steve

Strange. looks like it is recorded correctly here, and it is certainly working OK today. Try Diveinstruct, where exactly the same information should be available.